From rjm at swift.eng.ox.ac.uk  Wed Mar 20 20:16:10 1996
From: rjm at swift.eng.ox.ac.uk (Bob Manners)
Date: Wed, 20 Mar 1996 10:16:10 +0000 (GMT)
Subject: UNIX for 11/23
Message-ID: <m0tzKw7-00000DC@swift.eng.ox.ac.uk>


Having met with storming success (thanks Warren) in getting UNIX v6
and v7 up and running on my 11/34, and having recently (well
yesterday) acquired an 11/23+, I'd like to put UNIX on the latter.

Now, the 11/23 has 128Kw, a 10Mb RD51 winchester and an RX50 floppy. I
need to get hold of a version of UNIX (pref. v7) The UNIX in question
obviously needs to support the RD51. 

In the case of the 11/34 I built a UNIX image under a PDP-11 emulator
and KERMITed it to the 11/34. I plan to do the same in this case ...

Any suggestions welcome. Does v7 support RD series drives? If not,
what does?

Cheers,
Bob.

-- 

----------------------------------------------------------------------------
Robert Manners                                  Osney Laboratory
rjm at swift.eng.ox.ac.uk                          Dept of Engineering Science
                                                University of Oxford
                                                01865 288762
Computer Museum: http://swift.eng.ox.ac.uk/rjm/museum.html
Also:            http://swift.eng.ox.ac.uk

        "The comfort you've demanded is now mandatory" - Jello Biafra
----------------------------------------------------------------------------




From wkt at dolphin.cs.adfa.oz.au  Thu Mar 21 09:23:49 1996
From: wkt at dolphin.cs.adfa.oz.au (Warren Toomey)
Date: Thu, 21 Mar 1996 09:23:49 +1000 (EST)
Subject: UNIX for 11/23
In-Reply-To: <m0tzKw7-00000DC@swift.eng.ox.ac.uk> from "Bob Manners" at Mar 20, 96 10:16:10 am
Message-ID: <9603202323.AA23006@dolphin>

In atricle by Bob Manners:
> 
> Now, the 11/23 has 128Kw, a 10Mb RD51 winchester and an RX50 floppy. I
> need to get hold of a version of UNIX (pref. v7) The UNIX in question
> obviously needs to support the RD51. 
> 
> Does v7 support RD series drives? If not, what does?

v7 doesn't support RDs (just looked thru the archive), and I don't know
of anything that does. You'd probably have to write your own device driver :-(

	Warren


From sms at wlv.iipo.gtegsc.com  Thu Mar 21 08:39:32 1996
From: sms at wlv.iipo.gtegsc.com (Steven M. Schultz)
Date: Wed, 20 Mar 1996 14:39:32 -0800 (PST)
Subject: UNIX for 11/23
Message-ID: <199603202239.OAA28894@wlv.iipo.gtegsc.com>

Hi -

> From: wkt at dolphin.cs.adfa.oz.au (Warren Toomey)
> In article by Bob Manners:
> > 
> > Does v7 support RD series drives? If not, what does?
> 
> v7 doesn't support RDs (just looked thru the archive), and I don't know
> of anything that does. You'd probably have to write your own device driver :-(
> 	Warren

	Warren's correct.  MSCP support did not enter the 'BSD' picture until
	late 2.9BSD or early 2.10BSD.  TMSCP support for tapes didn't come
	about until early 2.11BSD when I "borrowed" the driver from 4.3BSD
	(who had earlier borrowed it from Ultrix).

	It should be noted that the MSCP (and to a greater degree TMSCP)
	is a *pig* - it's the largest driver in the system, rivaling the
	TTY subsystem sizewise.

	An 11/23 is already extremely cramped for address space even using
	simpler/smaller drivers such as the RK, RL, etc.  I seriously doubt
	the MSCP driver could be smashed in to a 11/23 kernel and leave room
	for too much else.  

	Steven Schultz
	sms at wlv.iipo.gtegsc.com



From rjm at swift.eng.ox.ac.uk  Thu Mar 21 19:44:37 1996
From: rjm at swift.eng.ox.ac.uk (Bob Manners)
Date: Thu, 21 Mar 1996 09:44:37 +0000 (GMT)
Subject: UNIX for 11/23 (fwd)
Message-ID: <m0tzgv7-00000DC@swift.eng.ox.ac.uk>

Forwarded message:
Subject: Re: UNIX for 11/23
To: wkt at csadfa.cs.adfa.oz.au (Warren Toomey)
Date: Thu, 21 Mar 1996 09:40:12 +0000 (GMT)
In-Reply-To: <9603202323.AA23006 at dolphin> from "Warren Toomey" at Mar 21, 96 09:23:49 am
X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23]
Content-Type: text

>
>In atricle by Bob Manners:
>> 
>> Now, the 11/23 has 128Kw, a 10Mb RD51 winchester and an RX50 floppy. I
>> need to get hold of a version of UNIX (pref. v7) The UNIX in question
>> obviously needs to support the RD51. 
>> 
>> Does v7 support RD series drives? If not, what does?
>
>v7 doesn't support RDs (just looked thru the archive), and I don't know
>of anything that does. You'd probably have to write your own device driver :-(

I beleive Digital's MV7 (I think) does support RDs. It is mentioned in
the 11/23+ Owners Manual. I'll have to check. I guess this version
isn't in the archive ...

Cheers,
Bob.

-- 

----------------------------------------------------------------------------
Robert Manners                                  Osney Laboratory
rjm at swift.eng.ox.ac.uk                          Dept of Engineering Science
                                                University of Oxford
                                                01865 288762
Computer Museum: http://swift.eng.ox.ac.uk/rjm/museum.html
Also:            http://swift.eng.ox.ac.uk

        "The comfort you've demanded is now mandatory" - Jello Biafra
----------------------------------------------------------------------------




-- 

----------------------------------------------------------------------------
Robert Manners                                  Osney Laboratory
rjm at swift.eng.ox.ac.uk                          Dept of Engineering Science
                                                University of Oxford
                                                01865 288762
Computer Museum: http://swift.eng.ox.ac.uk/rjm/museum.html
Also:            http://swift.eng.ox.ac.uk

        "The comfort you've demanded is now mandatory" - Jello Biafra
----------------------------------------------------------------------------




From rjm at swift.eng.ox.ac.uk  Thu Mar 21 19:44:25 1996
From: rjm at swift.eng.ox.ac.uk (Bob Manners)
Date: Thu, 21 Mar 1996 09:44:25 +0000 (GMT)
Subject: UNIX for 11/23 (fwd)
Message-ID: <m0tzguv-00000DC@swift.eng.ox.ac.uk>

Forwarded message:
Subject: Re: UNIX for 11/23
To: sms at wlv.iipo.gtegsc.com (Steven M. Schultz)
Date: Thu, 21 Mar 1996 09:43:47 +0000 (GMT)
In-Reply-To: <199603202239.OAA28894 at wlv.iipo.gtegsc.com> from "Steven M. Schultz" at Mar 20, 96 02:39:32 pm
X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23]
Content-Type: text


What about Digital's MV7 (or whatever it was called). This is
mentioned in the 11/23+ owners' manual as supported. Thus it must run
on the 11/23+ and support RD series disks. It is basically Bell Labs
version 7 I think.

>	Warren's correct.  MSCP support did not enter the 'BSD' picture until
>	late 2.9BSD or early 2.10BSD.  TMSCP support for tapes didn't come
>	about until early 2.11BSD when I "borrowed" the driver from 4.3BSD
>	(who had earlier borrowed it from Ultrix).

OK. I guess 2.x BSD (x>=9) requires separate I+D space? That would
rule out the 11/23+ I think.

>	It should be noted that the MSCP (and to a greater degree TMSCP)
>	is a *pig* - it's the largest driver in the system, rivaling the
>	TTY subsystem sizewise.

Yes. I can believe that. Looks like writing my own driver would be no
fun at all!

>	An 11/23 is already extremely cramped for address space even using
>	simpler/smaller drivers such as the RK, RL, etc.  I seriously doubt
>	the MSCP driver could be smashed in to a 11/23 kernel and leave room
>	for too much else.  

The 11/23+ has plenty of address space (22 bit), but mine only has 128Kw ...

Cheers,

Bob.
-- 

----------------------------------------------------------------------------
Robert Manners                                  Osney Laboratory
rjm at swift.eng.ox.ac.uk                          Dept of Engineering Science
                                                University of Oxford
                                                01865 288762
Computer Museum: http://swift.eng.ox.ac.uk/rjm/museum.html
Also:            http://swift.eng.ox.ac.uk

        "The comfort you've demanded is now mandatory" - Jello Biafra
----------------------------------------------------------------------------




-- 

----------------------------------------------------------------------------
Robert Manners                                  Osney Laboratory
rjm at swift.eng.ox.ac.uk                          Dept of Engineering Science
                                                University of Oxford
                                                01865 288762
Computer Museum: http://swift.eng.ox.ac.uk/rjm/museum.html
Also:            http://swift.eng.ox.ac.uk

        "The comfort you've demanded is now mandatory" - Jello Biafra
----------------------------------------------------------------------------




From sms at wlv.iipo.gtegsc.com  Fri Mar 22 02:31:20 1996
From: sms at wlv.iipo.gtegsc.com (Steven M. Schultz)
Date: Thu, 21 Mar 1996 08:31:20 -0800 (PST)
Subject: UNIX for 11/23 (fwd)
Message-ID: <199603211631.IAA19050@wlv.iipo.gtegsc.com>

Robert -

> I beleive Digital's MV7 (I think) does support RDs. It is mentioned in
> the 11/23+ Owners Manual. I'll have to check. I guess this version
> isn't in the archive ...

	True - Ultrix-11 (what MV7 was called later on) does have MSCP
	support in it.  I've not looked at how they handle the rather
	prodigious data space requirements (~2kb per controller) yet.

	Cheers.

	Steven



From rjm at swift.eng.ox.ac.uk  Wed Mar 20 20:16:10 1996
From: rjm at swift.eng.ox.ac.uk (Bob Manners)
Date: Wed, 20 Mar 1996 10:16:10 +0000 (GMT)
Subject: UNIX for 11/23
Message-ID: <m0tzKw7-00000DC@swift.eng.ox.ac.uk>


Having met with storming success (thanks Warren) in getting UNIX v6
and v7 up and running on my 11/34, and having recently (well
yesterday) acquired an 11/23+, I'd like to put UNIX on the latter.

Now, the 11/23 has 128Kw, a 10Mb RD51 winchester and an RX50 floppy. I
need to get hold of a version of UNIX (pref. v7) The UNIX in question
obviously needs to support the RD51. 

In the case of the 11/34 I built a UNIX image under a PDP-11 emulator
and KERMITed it to the 11/34. I plan to do the same in this case ...

Any suggestions welcome. Does v7 support RD series drives? If not,
what does?

Cheers,
Bob.

-- 

----------------------------------------------------------------------------
Robert Manners                                  Osney Laboratory
rjm at swift.eng.ox.ac.uk                          Dept of Engineering Science
                                                University of Oxford
                                                01865 288762
Computer Museum: http://swift.eng.ox.ac.uk/rjm/museum.html
Also:            http://swift.eng.ox.ac.uk

        "The comfort you've demanded is now mandatory" - Jello Biafra
----------------------------------------------------------------------------




From wkt at dolphin.cs.adfa.oz.au  Thu Mar 21 09:23:49 1996
From: wkt at dolphin.cs.adfa.oz.au (Warren Toomey)
Date: Thu, 21 Mar 1996 09:23:49 +1000 (EST)
Subject: UNIX for 11/23
In-Reply-To: <m0tzKw7-00000DC@swift.eng.ox.ac.uk> from "Bob Manners" at Mar 20, 96 10:16:10 am
Message-ID: <9603202323.AA23006@dolphin>

In atricle by Bob Manners:
> 
> Now, the 11/23 has 128Kw, a 10Mb RD51 winchester and an RX50 floppy. I
> need to get hold of a version of UNIX (pref. v7) The UNIX in question
> obviously needs to support the RD51. 
> 
> Does v7 support RD series drives? If not, what does?

v7 doesn't support RDs (just looked thru the archive), and I don't know
of anything that does. You'd probably have to write your own device driver :-(

	Warren


From sms at wlv.iipo.gtegsc.com  Thu Mar 21 08:39:32 1996
From: sms at wlv.iipo.gtegsc.com (Steven M. Schultz)
Date: Wed, 20 Mar 1996 14:39:32 -0800 (PST)
Subject: UNIX for 11/23
Message-ID: <199603202239.OAA28894@wlv.iipo.gtegsc.com>

Hi -

> From: wkt at dolphin.cs.adfa.oz.au (Warren Toomey)
> In article by Bob Manners:
> > 
> > Does v7 support RD series drives? If not, what does?
> 
> v7 doesn't support RDs (just looked thru the archive), and I don't know
> of anything that does. You'd probably have to write your own device driver :-(
> 	Warren

	Warren's correct.  MSCP support did not enter the 'BSD' picture until
	late 2.9BSD or early 2.10BSD.  TMSCP support for tapes didn't come
	about until early 2.11BSD when I "borrowed" the driver from 4.3BSD
	(who had earlier borrowed it from Ultrix).

	It should be noted that the MSCP (and to a greater degree TMSCP)
	is a *pig* - it's the largest driver in the system, rivaling the
	TTY subsystem sizewise.

	An 11/23 is already extremely cramped for address space even using
	simpler/smaller drivers such as the RK, RL, etc.  I seriously doubt
	the MSCP driver could be smashed in to a 11/23 kernel and leave room
	for too much else.  

	Steven Schultz
	sms at wlv.iipo.gtegsc.com



From rjm at swift.eng.ox.ac.uk  Thu Mar 21 19:44:37 1996
From: rjm at swift.eng.ox.ac.uk (Bob Manners)
Date: Thu, 21 Mar 1996 09:44:37 +0000 (GMT)
Subject: UNIX for 11/23 (fwd)
Message-ID: <m0tzgv7-00000DC@swift.eng.ox.ac.uk>

Forwarded message:
Subject: Re: UNIX for 11/23
To: wkt at csadfa.cs.adfa.oz.au (Warren Toomey)
Date: Thu, 21 Mar 1996 09:40:12 +0000 (GMT)
In-Reply-To: <9603202323.AA23006 at dolphin> from "Warren Toomey" at Mar 21, 96 09:23:49 am
X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23]
Content-Type: text

>
>In atricle by Bob Manners:
>> 
>> Now, the 11/23 has 128Kw, a 10Mb RD51 winchester and an RX50 floppy. I
>> need to get hold of a version of UNIX (pref. v7) The UNIX in question
>> obviously needs to support the RD51. 
>> 
>> Does v7 support RD series drives? If not, what does?
>
>v7 doesn't support RDs (just looked thru the archive), and I don't know
>of anything that does. You'd probably have to write your own device driver :-(

I beleive Digital's MV7 (I think) does support RDs. It is mentioned in
the 11/23+ Owners Manual. I'll have to check. I guess this version
isn't in the archive ...

Cheers,
Bob.

-- 

----------------------------------------------------------------------------
Robert Manners                                  Osney Laboratory
rjm at swift.eng.ox.ac.uk                          Dept of Engineering Science
                                                University of Oxford
                                                01865 288762
Computer Museum: http://swift.eng.ox.ac.uk/rjm/museum.html
Also:            http://swift.eng.ox.ac.uk

        "The comfort you've demanded is now mandatory" - Jello Biafra
----------------------------------------------------------------------------




-- 

----------------------------------------------------------------------------
Robert Manners                                  Osney Laboratory
rjm at swift.eng.ox.ac.uk                          Dept of Engineering Science
                                                University of Oxford
                                                01865 288762
Computer Museum: http://swift.eng.ox.ac.uk/rjm/museum.html
Also:            http://swift.eng.ox.ac.uk

        "The comfort you've demanded is now mandatory" - Jello Biafra
----------------------------------------------------------------------------




From rjm at swift.eng.ox.ac.uk  Thu Mar 21 19:44:25 1996
From: rjm at swift.eng.ox.ac.uk (Bob Manners)
Date: Thu, 21 Mar 1996 09:44:25 +0000 (GMT)
Subject: UNIX for 11/23 (fwd)
Message-ID: <m0tzguv-00000DC@swift.eng.ox.ac.uk>

Forwarded message:
Subject: Re: UNIX for 11/23
To: sms at wlv.iipo.gtegsc.com (Steven M. Schultz)
Date: Thu, 21 Mar 1996 09:43:47 +0000 (GMT)
In-Reply-To: <199603202239.OAA28894 at wlv.iipo.gtegsc.com> from "Steven M. Schultz" at Mar 20, 96 02:39:32 pm
X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23]
Content-Type: text


What about Digital's MV7 (or whatever it was called). This is
mentioned in the 11/23+ owners' manual as supported. Thus it must run
on the 11/23+ and support RD series disks. It is basically Bell Labs
version 7 I think.

>	Warren's correct.  MSCP support did not enter the 'BSD' picture until
>	late 2.9BSD or early 2.10BSD.  TMSCP support for tapes didn't come
>	about until early 2.11BSD when I "borrowed" the driver from 4.3BSD
>	(who had earlier borrowed it from Ultrix).

OK. I guess 2.x BSD (x>=9) requires separate I+D space? That would
rule out the 11/23+ I think.

>	It should be noted that the MSCP (and to a greater degree TMSCP)
>	is a *pig* - it's the largest driver in the system, rivaling the
>	TTY subsystem sizewise.

Yes. I can believe that. Looks like writing my own driver would be no
fun at all!

>	An 11/23 is already extremely cramped for address space even using
>	simpler/smaller drivers such as the RK, RL, etc.  I seriously doubt
>	the MSCP driver could be smashed in to a 11/23 kernel and leave room
>	for too much else.  

The 11/23+ has plenty of address space (22 bit), but mine only has 128Kw ...

Cheers,

Bob.
-- 

----------------------------------------------------------------------------
Robert Manners                                  Osney Laboratory
rjm at swift.eng.ox.ac.uk                          Dept of Engineering Science
                                                University of Oxford
                                                01865 288762
Computer Museum: http://swift.eng.ox.ac.uk/rjm/museum.html
Also:            http://swift.eng.ox.ac.uk

        "The comfort you've demanded is now mandatory" - Jello Biafra
----------------------------------------------------------------------------




-- 

----------------------------------------------------------------------------
Robert Manners                                  Osney Laboratory
rjm at swift.eng.ox.ac.uk                          Dept of Engineering Science
                                                University of Oxford
                                                01865 288762
Computer Museum: http://swift.eng.ox.ac.uk/rjm/museum.html
Also:            http://swift.eng.ox.ac.uk

        "The comfort you've demanded is now mandatory" - Jello Biafra
----------------------------------------------------------------------------




From sms at wlv.iipo.gtegsc.com  Fri Mar 22 02:31:20 1996
From: sms at wlv.iipo.gtegsc.com (Steven M. Schultz)
Date: Thu, 21 Mar 1996 08:31:20 -0800 (PST)
Subject: UNIX for 11/23 (fwd)
Message-ID: <199603211631.IAA19050@wlv.iipo.gtegsc.com>

Robert -

> I beleive Digital's MV7 (I think) does support RDs. It is mentioned in
> the 11/23+ Owners Manual. I'll have to check. I guess this version
> isn't in the archive ...

	True - Ultrix-11 (what MV7 was called later on) does have MSCP
	support in it.  I've not looked at how they handle the rather
	prodigious data space requirements (~2kb per controller) yet.

	Cheers.

	Steven



