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Date:- 16 June 2001

1================================================

Date: Fri, 15 Jun 2001 00:42:01 +1000
From: "Voytek Eymont" <voytekatsbt dot net dot au>
Subject: Re: [os2genau] [eCS] Not really eCS related, but very

In a message dated 2001-06-14 18:52:43 +0900 (EST) (Thu),
"John Angelico" <talldadatkepl dot com dot au> wrote:

> On Thu, 14 Jun 2001 11:03:17, Voytek Eymont wrote:
> 
> >** Reply to note from "John Angelico" <talldadatkepl dot com dot au> Fri, 01 Jun =
2001 13:09:10 +0900 (EST)
> >
> >
> >> Steve Gibson is doing us a HUGE favour here.
 
> He has signalled a fundamental security flaw in Win systems which,
> so far, MS has declined to fix. 
> 
> Surely that is a bonus for any non-MS OS in Internet-land. 

I had a quick read of it. Not so sure.
what was that saying, about dogs barking, but the caravan moving on ?

 
> Yep. And ShieldsUp and PortProbe are just as good in the
> Internet-world. I test every so often to make sure I am not a risk
> to myself or others while online.

but are they really a better tool than say a port scanner ?


Voytek Eymont
voytekatsbt dot net dot au
www.sbt dot net dot au/links/
*********************************

2=============================================

From: "Ian Manners" <deadmail>
Date: Fri, 15 Jun 2001 02:41:41 +1000 (EST)
Subject: [os2genau] Belgian OS/2 User Group eCS Demo

Forwarded from the eCS List.

By Luc Van Bogaert

I'd like to share a short report on my first personal eCS 
experience, during the eCS demo at the Belgian OS/2 User 
Group, done by Mensys. There might be some inaccuries in this 
report, because it's been over a very busy week since I 
attended this presentation and unfortunately I don't have a 
photographical memory.

Joachim Benjamins and Roderick Klein from Mensys were invited 
to show eCS (release candidate) at the June 8 meeting of the 
OS/2 User Group Belgium.

They brought two machines with them to do the presentation, a 
desktop machine and a laptop. We had those machines connected 
to a VGA-projector w/ screen and the other on a very nice, 
very large Philips flat plasma screen. I don't know the specs 
of those machines and wether they had SCSI on board.

IIRC, they first showed the boot to Desktop from CD and 
explained that you are able to boot to a fully working eCS 
desktop this way, including internet support through USB 
modem.

To demo the installation process, they started booting the 
desktop machine from CD and when the pre-boot configuration 
text screen came up, paused a little while to explain some of 
the options on this screen. Of course, the SCSI boot options 
were all there, as well as other options related to video, 
etc. Even though pure text mode, the screen layout looked 
quite professionally done IMO.

Then they started the actual installation, and paused again to 
explain about another graphical dialog window with several 
installation options. Then they continued the installation to 
the point where the progression gauge is displayed. At some 
point a very cool animation is played and everything seems to 
be very well layed out, well polished and easy to use and 
understand. Let me tell you that the graphical part of the 
install looks great, all enhanced with new eStyler controls, 
etc.

With the first installation phase in progress, Joachim talked 
about some of the work that had be done to come to the current 
status and explained what's in the pipeline for eCS. They also 
had some interesting things to share about multimedia support 
and how Mensys is working with several companies to improve 
this aspect in eCS. They also talked about what difficulties 
still have to be overcome in developing and improving eCS. 
Difficulties of technical, economical, legal and "political" 
nature.

The first installation phase ended without any hickups in 
about 9 minutes or so. Then came time to reboot and that's 
where the only problem in the whole presentation occured : the 
machine failed to reboot after the first installation phase. 
They explained what they thought was going on, but I didn't 
catch many of that, and I got the impression that they didn't 
have a clue either.

Anyway, what they did was start all over again, but this time 
using another CD containing the very latest eCS track, that 
they had received just the same day or the day before. On this 
one, the boot logo (which looks very nice) was modified once 
again so they told us. Everything went smooth from that point 
on, and the first installation phase completed even faster 
than the first attempt.

No problems during reboot this time, and on to the second 
installation phase. At this stage, it clearly shows that 
there's still a lot of work to do to reach the same polish and 
ease-of-use as the first installation phase. Here, some of the 
well-known IBM installers show up. However, I also noticed how 
the WarpGuides are used to install a printer : very nice, very 
well done. Networking install seems the same as it always was, 
except that some dialog windows with help text pop up to guide 
the user through the install, or at least provide some 
meaningfull information about what is going.

I'm not sure, but I think they then did a second reboot to 
completely finish the installation.

Afterwards, some of the eCS features were discussed, including 
DToC which was briefly demonstrated in a connection to a 
machine of one of the attendees, and ofcourse WiseMachine was 
also demonstrated and discussed.

To summarize, Mensys did a succesful presentation of eCS in 
Belgium, and to me eCS looks ready for the masses. The 
installer works and is *much *faster then ever before, eCS has 
some very nice interface enhancements, and of course the 
feature set and the included software collection can hardly be 
matched by other operating systems today. However, it still 
needs improvement in some areas, of which networking 
installation is the most important IMO. Multimedia support 
should be improved as well, and it is very reassuring that 
Mensys amongst others is currently working hard on this. 
Personally, I'd like to have more GUI updates in the version 
following v1.0 :-) Some of the icons look really sharp, but 
I'd like to have *all the icons on the system look that way. I 
also don't care too much for the bitmap backgrounds in 
folders, but that of course is purely personal taste and easy 
to solve.

END FORWARD MESSAGE.

Cheers
Ian B Manners

3=============================================

From: "John Angelico" <talldadatkepl dot com dot au>
Date: Fri, 15 Jun 2001 09:26:07 +0900 (EST)
Subject: Re: [os2genau] [eCS] Not really eCS related, but very

On Fri, 15 Jun 2001 00:42:01 +1000, Voytek Eymont wrote:

Hi Voytek.

>In a message dated 2001-06-14 18:52:43 +0900 (EST) (Thu),
>"John Angelico" <talldadatkepl dot com dot au> wrote:
>
>> On Thu, 14 Jun 2001 11:03:17, Voytek Eymont wrote:
>> 
>> >** Reply to note from "John Angelico" <talldadatkepl dot com dot au> Fri, 01 Jun 2001 13:09:10 +0900 (EST)
>> >
>> >
>> >> Steve Gibson is doing us a HUGE favour here.
> 
>> He has signalled a fundamental security flaw in Win systems which,
>> so far, MS has declined to fix. 
>> 
>> Surely that is a bonus for any non-MS OS in Internet-land. 
>
>I had a quick read of it. Not so sure.
>what was that saying, about dogs barking, but the caravan moving on ?

We both know that in MS terms the dogs bark, but the caravan hardly
ever moves on, because of what Steve describes - the inertia of
most apathetic Win operators (home SOHO and corporate) who DO NOT
apply all the security fixes, along with the terrible problems of
the fixes themselves - MS design philosophy: patch on a patch. 

Check Woody Leonhard's Woody's Office Watch newsletters for an
informed  intelligent supporter of MS products who is scathingly
critical ofthe MS coding approach.

>
> 
>> Yep. And ShieldsUp and PortProbe are just as good in the
>> Internet-world. I test every so often to make sure I am not a risk
>> to myself or others while online.
>
>but are they really a better tool than say a port scanner ?

Read what he says - they are software port scanners for people like
me who don't run a lot of gear, don't run servers and need some
assurance about our Internet interface. 

I happen to have enough conscience and moral fibre to preach a
gospel of TWO-WAY internet security - especially to Win users who
don't know.


Best regards
John Angelico
OS/2 SIG
talldadatmelbpc dot org dot au or talldadatkepl dot com dot au
--------------------------------------------

PMTagline v1.50 - Copyright, 1996-1997, Stephen Berg and John Angelico
.... eCS: too powerful to be Windows, too easy to be Unix.

4=============================================

Date: Fri, 15 Jun 2001 10:26:21 
From: Voytek Eymont <voytekatsbt dot net dot au>
Subject: Re: [os2genau] [eCS] Not really eCS related, but very interesting...

** Reply to note from "John Angelico" <talldadatkepl dot com dot au> Thu, 14 Jun 2001 18:52:43 +0900 (EST)


> >> Steve Gibson is doing us a HUGE favour here. 
> > 


I really hate to be cynical.... but Steve has software to sell to windows
users, I guess, that's his 1st and only priority;

he also seems to point out flaws in TCP/IP design, rather than anything
else; (from what I've read of his pages)

whereas you and I know that, OS/2 'as is' overcomes a number of these
problems, that, alternative solutions existed on OS/2, that alternative
apps existed of OS/2 since year dot, etc, etc, etc; Steve has never pointed
that out, and, I'd be willing to be he never will (I r h t b c, but)

I really hate to be cynical.... but Steve has software to sell to windows
users, that's his 1st and only priority;


(oh, yes: did you see the part where he says that result of his
PostScan/Probe might be unreliable as the Win server he uses has
fundemantal bugs that cause unreliable output ? but, he will fix it, of
course. I r h t b c, but)

to sum it up:

I really hate to be cynical.... but that's my final contribution to this
futile thread.



Voytek Eymont
SBT Information Systems Pty Ltd
http://www.sbt dot net dot au/links/
phone +61-2 9310-1144 fax +61-2 9310-1118 

5=============================================

Date: Fri, 15 Jun 2001 11:26:35 
From: Voytek Eymont <voytekatsbt dot net dot au>
Subject: [os2genau] W4 CP1 install Trap d on 3rd floppy

just tried to install W4 CP1 on C-MMX300A 128MB AHA2940;

this system runs normally W4 FP14 TCP/IP4.1 on D:

booting from floppy, after 3rd disk it goes to:


Trap 000d

14.062_W4

tried a couple times, even, after full power off, same

any ideas ?

meanwhile, rebboted from D:, works fine

help....




Voytek Eymont
SBT Information Systems Pty Ltd
http://www.sbt dot net dot au/links/
phone +61-2 9310-1144 fax +61-2 9310-1118 

6=============================================

Date: Fri, 15 Jun 2001 11:39:28 
From: Voytek Eymont <voytekatsbt dot net dot au>
Subject: [os2genau] is W4 CP1 ok on a pre-pentium ? CP1 extras CDs

I have some 486s running W4 FP12;

is W4 CP1 OK on a 486 ?

the reson I'm thinking about upgrading, as it would be nice to run same
level across all systems.....

also, with the CP, there are 3 extra CDs with TCP/IP, etc,

all that stuff on the extra CDs, that';s already in the CP1 install, no ?



Voytek Eymont
SBT Information Systems Pty Ltd
http://www.sbt dot net dot au/links/
phone +61-2 9310-1144 fax +61-2 9310-1118 

7=============================================

Date: Fri, 15 Jun 2001 12:05:31 
From: Voytek Eymont <voytekatsbt dot net dot au>
Subject: [os2genau] what's the keystroke combo to get behind the install full screen ?

there used to be, is ? a keystroke combo to get behind the W4 install full
screen ?

so I can do things whilst the install installs ?

(damn, in the original Warp, you were able to do all that stuff, then, they
try to block it)



Voytek Eymont
SBT Information Systems Pty Ltd
http://www.sbt dot net dot au/links/
phone +61-2 9310-1144 fax +61-2 9310-1118 

8=============================================

From: "John Angelico" <talldadatkepl dot com dot au>
Date: Fri, 15 Jun 2001 13:27:35 +0900 (EST)
Subject: Re: [os2genau] Was [os2genau] [eCS] Not really eCS related, but very interesting... now closed

Since I find it irksome to not have the last word...

On Fri, 15 Jun 2001 10:26:21, Voytek Eymont wrote:

>** Reply to note from "John Angelico" <talldadatkepl dot com dot au> Thu, 14 Jun 2001 18:52:43 +0900 (EST)
>
>
>> >> Steve Gibson is doing us a HUGE favour here. 
>> > 
>
>
>I really hate to be cynical.... but Steve has software to sell to windows
>users, I guess, that's his 1st and only priority;

OK - but we read him and take note of what we need to know, filter
it through our own biases.

>
>he also seems to point out flaws in TCP/IP design, rather than anything
>else; (from what I've read of his pages)

What - I hope you hadn't thought we were in networking nirvana with
a perfect protocol!! <GD&R>

>whereas you and I know that, OS/2 'as is' overcomes a number of these
>problems, that, alternative solutions existed on OS/2, that alternative
>apps existed of OS/2 since year dot, etc, etc, etc; Steve has never pointed
>that out, and, I'd be willing to be he never will (I r h t b c, but)

'Soright - we have thick skins, and it's nice to know someone else
confirms the validity of OS/2 solutions even if they don't know it
or like it.

>I really hate to be cynical.... but Steve has software to sell to windows
>users, that's his 1st and only priority;

He has to eat too. I don't have to do things his way but if he
offers a service that I can use, that's OK.
 
>
>(oh, yes: did you see the part where he says that result of his
>PostScan/Probe might be unreliable as the Win server he uses has
>fundemantal bugs that cause unreliable output ? but, he will fix it, of
>course. I r h t b c, but)

Yes. That's new - wasn't there when I first found his site, nor
even recently. Silly him, he's gone onto Win2K. [There's no
accounting for taste :) ] But he's offered a workaround.

>to sum it up:
>
>I really hate to be cynical.... but that's my final contribution to this
>futile thread.

Just beware that you don't become a permanent cynic:

cy'nic: n. person who knows the cost of everything and the value of
nothing 



Best regards
John Angelico
OS/2 SIG
talldadatmelbpc dot org dot au or talldadatkepl dot com dot au
--------------------------------------------

PMTagline v1.50 - Copyright, 1996-1997, Stephen Berg and John Angelico
.... eCS: too powerful to be Windows, too easy to be Unix.

9=============================================

Date: Fri, 15 Jun 2001 15:56:42 +1000
From: Michael Taylor <miketatpcug dot org dot au>
Subject: Re: [os2genau] what's the keystroke combo to get behind the install full  screen ?

Alt-F3 or Ctrl-F3 - still works with eCS Preview 1.

Voytek Eymont wrote:
> 
> there used to be, is ? a keystroke combo to get behind the W4 install full
> screen ?
> 
> so I can do things whilst the install installs ?
> 
> (damn, in the original Warp, you were able to do all that stuff, then, they
> try to block it)
> 
> Voytek Eymont
> SBT Information Systems Pty Ltd
> http://www.sbt dot net dot au/links/
> phone +61-2 9310-1144 fax +61-2 9310-1118

-- 
Regards,
Mick

--
-----------------------------------------------------------------------
    Michael Taylor                             miketatinteract dot net dot au
   -----------------------------------------------------------------
             Home Page: http://users.interact dot net dot au/~pmiy/
             Michael Taylor                   +61 6 2575400
   -----------------------------------------------------------------

-----------------------------------------------------------------------

10=============================================

Date: Fri, 15 Jun 2001 18:15:36 
From: Voytek Eymont <voytekatsbt dot net dot au>
Subject: [os2genau] W4.5 CP1 TCP/IP amongst native wildlife

OK, the story so far:

I was trying to upgrade echidna to W4.5 CP1;
it runs W4 FP14 TCP/IP 4.1 SMC EPII NIC;

install does Trap 000d on 3rd floppy;

so, I've booted bunyip from same floppies;
W4.5 CP1 installed OK, no error, on bynyip Intel 8/16 NIC

(except, when it asked about Java 1.3, I said YES, but, the install
dissapered somewhere and never reapered)

edit setup.cmd: REM net route

bunyip booted OK

I now InfoZIPed bunyip, and, unzipped onto echidna;
edited setup.cmd for IP address, edited config for hostname;
edited \ibmlan\ini for NIC; edited ibmcom\ini for netBIOS name

echidna booted OK

BUT:

intermittent PING, can not ping certain other hosts here, some hosts can not
ping echidna and/or bunyip

can not share drive on either, share says 'SERVER not started'
'net start req' says: requester started
'net start server' says 'no such service'

solution:
reboot back to old system (W4 FP14 TCP/IP4/1); then go home

any better ideas ?


Voytek Eymont
SBT Information Systems Pty Ltd
http://www.sbt dot net dot au/links/
phone +61-2 9310-1144 fax +61-2 9310-1118 

11=============================================

From: "Ian Manners" <deadmail>
Date: Fri, 15 Jun 2001 19:45:08 +1000 (EST)
Subject: Re: [os2genau] W4.5 CP1 TCP/IP amongst native wildlife

Hi Voytek

First, check that you have a file called "services" in your
x:\mptn\etc directory.

re the SCSI install, I cant comment, as that wonderful
company called IBM that I bought SC from, still hasnt
given even bothered returning my phone calls re were
is my CP !!

I think the next time I buy something, it will be from Serenity,
or on the bigger iron front, from SUN, you'd think that they
would at least phone me back due to the $$ I've spend in the
last year on RS/6000 and  Websphere Pro for AIX.

ok, thats my bitch for now :-) Just had to say it.

It is standard with that Adaptec card to install via floppies,
and I then copy the latest SCSI driver into the x:\os2\boot
directory.

Cheers
Ian B Manners

12=============================================

Date: Fri, 15 Jun 2001 20:19:52 +1000
From: Ed Durrant <edurrantatbigpond dot net dot au>
Subject: Re: [os2genau] W4 CP1 install Trap d on 3rd floppy

Hi Voytek,

  Does this system have a network card in it ? If so which make ??
Also are you sure there's no special requirements of the Cd Drive ?

Cheers/2

Ed.

Voytek Eymont wrote:
> 
> just tried to install W4 CP1 on C-MMX300A 128MB AHA2940;
> 
> this system runs normally W4 FP14 TCP/IP4.1 on D:
> 
> booting from floppy, after 3rd disk it goes to:
> 
> Trap 000d
> 
> 14.062_W4
> 
> tried a couple times, even, after full power off, same
> 
> any ideas ?
> 
> meanwhile, rebboted from D:, works fine
> 
> help....
> 
> Voytek Eymont
> SBT Information Systems Pty Ltd
> http://www.sbt dot net dot au/links/
> phone +61-2 9310-1144 fax +61-2 9310-1118

13=============================================

Date: Fri, 15 Jun 2001 20:25:22 +1000
From: Ed Durrant <edurrantatbigpond dot net dot au>
Subject: Re: [os2genau] W4.5 CP1 TCP/IP amongst native wildlife

What message does NET START PEER give you ?

Ed.

Voytek Eymont wrote:
> 
> OK, the story so far:
> 
> I was trying to upgrade echidna to W4.5 CP1;
> it runs W4 FP14 TCP/IP 4.1 SMC EPII NIC;
> 
> install does Trap 000d on 3rd floppy;
> 
> so, I've booted bunyip from same floppies;
> W4.5 CP1 installed OK, no error, on bynyip Intel 8/16 NIC
> 
> (except, when it asked about Java 1.3, I said YES, but, the install
> dissapered somewhere and never reapered)
> 
> edit setup.cmd: REM net route
> 
> bunyip booted OK
> 
> I now InfoZIPed bunyip, and, unzipped onto echidna;
> edited setup.cmd for IP address, edited config for hostname;
> edited \ibmlan\ini for NIC; edited ibmcom\ini for netBIOS name
> 
> echidna booted OK
> 
> BUT:
> 
> intermittent PING, can not ping certain other hosts here, some hosts can not
> ping echidna and/or bunyip
> 
> can not share drive on either, share says 'SERVER not started'
> 'net start req' says: requester started
> 'net start server' says 'no such service'
> 
> solution:
> reboot back to old system (W4 FP14 TCP/IP4/1); then go home
> 
> any better ideas ?
> 
> Voytek Eymont
> SBT Information Systems Pty Ltd
> http://www.sbt dot net dot au/links/
> phone +61-2 9310-1144 fax +61-2 9310-1118
