Subject: [os2genau_digest] No. 1757
From: Digest <deadmail>
To: "OS/2GenAu Digest"<deadmail>
Date: Wed, 10 Dec 2008 00:01:38 AET-10EDT,10,1,0,7200,4,1,0,7200,3600

**************************************************
Tuesday 09 December 2008
 Number  1757
**************************************************

Subjects for today
 
1  Re:  large drives and long JFS format : Ian Manners" <deadmail>
2  Re:  large drives and long JFS format : Mike O'Connor <mikeoc at internode.on dot net>
3  Re:  large drives and long JFS format : Ian Manners" <deadmail>
4  Re:  large drives and long JFS format : Mike O'Connor <mikeoc at internode.on dot net>
5  Re:  large drives and long JFS format : Ed Durrant <edurrant at durrant dot mine dot nu>
6  Re:  large drives and long JFS format : Ed Durrant <edurrant at durrant dot mine dot nu>
7  Re:  large drives and long JFS format : Ian Manners" <deadmail>
8  Re:  Java programming : Voytek Eymont" <voytek at sbt dot net dot au>
9  Re:  large drives and long JFS format : Mike O'Connor <mikeoc at internode.on dot net>
10  Re:  large drives and long JFS format : Ian Manners" <deadmail>
11  Re:  large drives and long JFS format : Mike O'Connor <mikeoc at internode.on dot net>
12  Re:  Java programming : Peter L Allen" <allenpl at tastelfibre dot com dot au>
13  Re:  Java programming : Chris Graham [WarpSpeed]" <chrisg at warpspeed dot com dot au>
14  Re:  Java programming : Chris Graham [WarpSpeed]" <chrisg at warpspeed dot com dot au>
15  Re:  Java programming : Mike O'Connor <mikeoc at internode.on dot net>

**= Email   1 ==========================**

Date:  Tue, 09 Dec 2008 00:21:48 +1100 (EDT)
From:  "Ian Manners" <deadmail>
Subject:  Re:  large drives and long JFS format

Just for the record,

>There is also a thread on it at os2world dot com.
>It appears some people have problems with drives greater than
>500Gb, I've been running a 5xxGb Seagate SATA-II drive now for
>at least 12 months with no problems so I wonder if their problem
>is a combination of things, Dani's driver ?
>Would need some indepth testing to find out.

Boot drive cannot exceed 500Gb, not talking about partitions
here but the actual drive.

Secondary drive can be upto 2Tb's.

This explains why I'm not having problems, my boot
drive is 80G (C drive), with a 500Gb drive as my secondary
(D drive), both are SATA-II

Cheers
Ian Manners
http://www.os2site dot com/

----------------------------------------------------------------------------------
 
**= Email   2 ==========================**

Date:  Mon, 08 Dec 2008 23:53:12 +1000
From:  Mike O'Connor <mikeoc at internode.on dot net>
Subject:  Re:  large drives and long JFS format

Ian Manners wrote:
> Just for the record,
>> There is also a thread on it at os2world dot com.
>> It appears some people have problems with drives greater than
>> 500Gb, I've been running a 5xxGb Seagate SATA-II drive now for
>> at least 12 months with no problems so I wonder if their problem
>> is a combination of things, Dani's driver ?
>> Would need some indepth testing to find out.
>>     
> Boot drive cannot exceed 500Gb, not talking about partitions
> here but the actual drive.
>
> Secondary drive can be upto 2Tb's.
>
> This explains why I'm not having problems, my boot
> drive is 80G (C drive), with a 500Gb drive as my secondary
> (D drive), both are SATA-II
>
> Cheers
> Ian Manners
Hi Ian,

Actually Boot disk size can exceed 512GB, but only the first 512GB of a 
Bootable disk will be usable. See following section 3.10 from the readme 
in the IBM docs with current OS2DASD.DMD:

Notice also the zero-based DISK numbering scheme used as parameters to 
os2dasd.dmd, and occasionally used internally in LVM.(critically read 
output from "lvm /startlog:<some-file>")

3.10 Very Large (512 Gb limit) Hard Drive Considerations
  ________________________________________________________
 
  The previous version  of OS2DASD.DMD had a 512  Gb geometry limitation 
which
  allowed only part (remainder of the  total drive capacity divided by 
the 512
  Gb) of the hard drive to be accessible for the system.

  The  current version  of OS2DASD.DMD  removes  this limit  and allows  
total
  capacity  of the  hard drive  up to  2 Tb.  This support  has  the 
following
  options:

  1.  If the  drive is used as  a boot drive, only  first 512 Gb  of the 
drive
      space will be accessable to the system.

  2.  If drive is used only as a  data storage drive the total capacity 
(up to
      2 Tb) of drive will be accessable to the system.

      The two new parameters are available to select these options:

  o /BOOTABLE --- applied to  the unpartitioned large drive (during the 
bootup
      prior to the first partitioning  of the drive) and makes drive 
bootable,
      but limiting its available capacity to 512 Gb.

  o /FULLSIZE --- applied to  the unpartitioned large drive (during the 
bootup
      prior to the first partitioning of the drive) and allow use of the 
total
      capacity of  the drive (up to 2  Tb), but prevents the  drive from 
being
      made bootable.

  The parameters have the following usage syntax:

  BASEDEV=OS2DASD.DMD [/D:n] [/BOOTABLE | /FULLSIZE]

  where  /D:n  denotes the  number  of  the drive  (/D:0  is  drive 0,  
etc.).
  Parameter /BOOTABLE  or /FULLSIZE following /D:n  is applied to  drive 
n. If
  for some  drive value n  (n>0) the /D:n  parameter is omitted  the 
following
  parameter (/BOOTABLE  or /FULLSIZE) is  applied to the first  drive 
(default
  /D:0).   If parameter  /BOOTABLE or  /FULLSIZE  for some  drive is  
omitted,
  /FULLSIZE is applied for this drive by default.

  If drive  is larger than 512 Gb,  then LVMUPDT package must  be 
installed in
  addition to the IDEDASD package to access the full drive capacity 
(/FULLSIZE
  option). If drive  is not larger than 512 Gb that  IDEDASD package is 
enough
  to access the  full drive capacity, but LVMUPDT package  may be 
installed in
  addition.

regards,
Mike
----------------------------------------------------------------------------------

**= Email   3 ==========================**

Date:  Tue, 09 Dec 2008 01:27:38 +1100 (EDT)
From:  "Ian Manners" <deadmail>
Subject:  Re:  large drives and long JFS format

Hi Mike,

>Actually Boot disk size can exceed 512GB, but only the first 512GB of a 
>Bootable disk will be usable. See following section 3.10 from the readme 
>in the IBM docs with current OS2DASD.DMD:

I was thinking I should have reworded that, trust you to spot it :-)

The rest I left out on the probably wrong assumption that
people would read the LVM and OS2DASD readme's.

Cheers
Ian Manners
http://www.os2site dot com/

----------------------------------------------------------------------------------
 
**= Email   4 ==========================**

Date:  Tue, 09 Dec 2008 02:04:00 +1000
From:  Mike O'Connor <mikeoc at internode.on dot net>
Subject:  Re:  large drives and long JFS format

Ian Manners wrote:
> Hi Mike,
>
>   
>> Actually Boot disk size can exceed 512GB, but only the first 512GB of a 
>> Bootable disk will be usable. See following section 3.10 from the readme 
>> in the IBM docs with current OS2DASD.DMD:
>>     
>
> I was thinking I should have reworded that, trust you to spot it :-)
>
> The rest I left out on the probably wrong assumption that
> people would read the LVM and OS2DASD readme's.
>
> Cheers
> Ian Manners
>   
Hi Ian,

Internode MAIL cluster was being worked over for a couple of hours - 
scheduled though, so I was off-line effectively. I think the zero-based 
drive was the important thing there in the os2dasd.dmd switches - Ed 
hadn't realised it and was applying it to the incorrect drive - 
hopefully now he will have success.

Regards,
Mike

----------------------------------------------------------------------------------

**= Email   5 ==========================**

Date:  Tue, 09 Dec 2008 07:16:54 +1100
From:  Ed Durrant <edurrant at durrant dot mine dot nu>
Subject:  Re:  large drives and long JFS format

Ian Manners wrote:
> Just for the record,
>
>   
>> There is also a thread on it at os2world dot com.
>> It appears some people have problems with drives greater than
>> 500Gb, I've been running a 5xxGb Seagate SATA-II drive now for
>> at least 12 months with no problems so I wonder if their problem
>> is a combination of things, Dani's driver ?
>> Would need some indepth testing to find out.
>>     
>
> Boot drive cannot exceed 500Gb, not talking about partitions
> here but the actual drive.
>
> Secondary drive can be upto 2Tb's.
>
> This explains why I'm not having problems, my boot
> drive is 80G (C drive), with a 500Gb drive as my secondary
> (D drive), both are SATA-II
>
> Cheers
> Ian Manners
> http://www.os2site dot com/
>
>   
that's interesting as LVMGUI allowed me to create my 750GB SATA drive as 
one bootable volume - haven't tried putting an OS on it yet though, just 
using it as a backup data drive at present.

Cheers/2

Ed.
----------------------------------------------------------------------------------

**= Email   6 ==========================**

Date:  Tue, 09 Dec 2008 07:18:56 +1100
From:  Ed Durrant <edurrant at durrant dot mine dot nu>
Subject:  Re:  large drives and long JFS format

Mike O'Connor wrote:
> Ian Manners wrote:
>> Hi Mike,
>>
>>> Actually Boot disk size can exceed 512GB, but only the first 512GB 
>>> of a Bootable disk will be usable. See following section 3.10 from 
>>> the readme in the IBM docs with current OS2DASD.DMD:
>>
>> I was thinking I should have reworded that, trust you to spot it :-)
>>
>> The rest I left out on the probably wrong assumption that
>> people would read the LVM and OS2DASD readme's.
>>
>> Cheers
>> Ian Manners
> Hi Ian,
>
> Internode MAIL cluster was being worked over for a couple of hours - 
> scheduled though, so I was off-line effectively. I think the 
> zero-based drive was the important thing there in the os2dasd.dmd 
> switches - Ed hadn't realised it and was applying it to the incorrect 
> drive - hopefully now he will have success.
>
> Regards,
> Mike
>
> --
Well, I haven't had any Trap0008's laterly but I haven't really been 
testing it yet.

Cheers/2

Ed.
----------------------------------------------------------------------------------

**= Email   7 ==========================**

Date:  Tue, 09 Dec 2008 08:46:33 +1100 (EDT)
From:  "Ian Manners" <deadmail>
Subject:  Re:  large drives and long JFS format

Hi Ed,

>that's interesting as LVMGUI allowed me to create my 750GB SATA drive as 
>one bootable volume - haven't tried putting an OS on it yet though, just 
>using it as a backup data drive at present.

It allowed me to LVM and format a 1Tb drive lastnight, I xcopied 
OS/2 across, (didnt use any switches), disconnected both my normal
SATA disks and booted ok to the 1Tb disk, strange, didnt have to set
the drive bootable in LVM, had a CD handy thinking I was going to
have to. Ran pmmail and seamonkey ok.

Left the computer up overnight and this morning when I turned the
monitor on the mouse pointer worked but nothing else did.
Rebooted and started using the PC with Seamonkey, PMMail,
opened OpenOffice and splat, died with only the mouse pointer
working. rebooted again and the boot is stuck around the VirtualPC
driver. a few reboots and PC freezes about same spot with
HD light on full each time.

Reconnected my main to HD's and here I am.

I suspect if I zap the partitions and run with the /BOOTABLE
switch, clean partition, and have the 1Tb drive as primary then
I will only see 512Gb of the drive but it will boot fine.

I'll try that next time. This is just messing around to see what
happens in moments of waiting for other things :-)

Cheers
Ian Manners
http://www.os2site dot com/

----------------------------------------------------------------------------------
 
**= Email   8 ==========================**

Date:  Tue, 9 Dec 2008 10:31:26 +1100 (EST)
From:  "Voytek Eymont" <voytek at sbt dot net dot au>
Subject:  Re:  Java programming

<quote who="Peter Moylan">

> Hint to anyone buying a Windows machine: insist on getting XP installed..
> XP is a very major improvement over Vista.

perhaps if you quadrupled RAM and processor speed, it might be OK?
(just a guess, no experience to back it up)

fwiw, if you have Vista, MS will back trade it to XP, and, give you XP
install number

-- 
Voytek

----------------------------------------------------------------------------------
 
**= Email   9 ==========================**

Date:  Tue, 09 Dec 2008 16:26:26 +1000
From:  Mike O'Connor <mikeoc at internode.on dot net>
Subject:  Re:  large drives and long JFS format

Ian Manners wrote:
> It allowed me to LVM and format a 1Tb drive lastnight, I xcopied 
> OS/2 across, (didnt use any switches), disconnected both my normal
> SATA disks and booted ok to the 1Tb disk, strange, didnt have to set
> the drive bootable in LVM, had a CD handy thinking I was going to
> have to. Ran pmmail and seamonkey ok.
>
> Left the computer up overnight and this morning when I turned the
> monitor on the mouse pointer worked but nothing else did.
> Rebooted and started using the PC with Seamonkey, PMMail,
> opened OpenOffice and splat, died with only the mouse pointer
> working. rebooted again and the boot is stuck around the VirtualPC
> driver. a few reboots and PC freezes about same spot with
> HD light on full each time.
>
> Reconnected my main to HD's and here I am.
>
> I suspect if I zap the partitions and run with the /BOOTABLE
> switch, clean partition, and have the 1Tb drive as primary then
> I will only see 512Gb of the drive but it will boot fine.
>
> I'll try that next time. This is just messing around to see what
> happens in moments of waiting for other things :-)
>
> Cheers
> Ian Manners
Hi Ian,

I'm assuming that you're using DANIS506.ADD with that setup - it would 
be interesting to see how it would handle that next trial using the 
IBM1S506.ADD in lieu of Dani's?

Regards,
Mike

----------------------------------------------------------------------------------

**= Email   10 ==========================**

Date:  Tue, 09 Dec 2008 17:30:50 +1100 (EDT)
From:  "Ian Manners" <deadmail>
Subject:  Re:  large drives and long JFS format

Hi Mike,

>I'm assuming that you're using DANIS506.ADD with that setup - it would 
>be interesting to see how it would handle that next trial using the 
>IBM1S506.ADD in lieu of Dani's?

Yes, used Dani's drivers for that.
Both have the same limitations but maybe the IBM wont get
as far, might try it again with the IBM after a clean scrub of
the disk to make sure its virginal.

Cheers
Ian Manners
http://www.os2site dot com/

----------------------------------------------------------------------------------
 
**= Email   11 ==========================**

Date:  Tue, 09 Dec 2008 20:19:38 +1000
From:  Mike O'Connor <mikeoc at internode.on dot net>
Subject:  Re:  large drives and long JFS format

Ian Manners wrote:
> Hi Mike,
>> I'm assuming that you're using DANIS506.ADD with that setup - it would 
>> be interesting to see how it would handle that next trial using the 
>> IBM1S506.ADD in lieu of Dani's?
> Yes, used Dani's drivers for that.
> Both have the same limitations but maybe the IBM wont get
> as far, might try it again with the IBM after a clean scrub of
> the disk to make sure its virginal.
>
> Cheers
> Ian Manners
Hi Ian,

As they say "We live in interesting times!"

Regards,
Mike
[from RC6a with Panorama and loving it - SMP not yet enabled - but 
power's off (first time ever!) - fast & clean - even comes up clean 
after failed (locked-up solid - no MOU/KYB (USB)) resume from suspend]!
----------------------------------------------------------------------------------

**= Email   12 ==========================**

Date:  Tue, 09 Dec 2008 21:25:05 +1000 (EST)
From:  "Peter L Allen" <allenpl at tastelfibre dot com dot au>
Subject:  Re:  Java programming

snip

>For extra credit: how do you delete Internet Explorer from a Windows 
>installation?) There used to be a program like this, but I've forgotten 
>its name and in any case a lot of its recommendations are probably 
>obsolete by now.

http://www.litepc dot com/

To just remove IE check out their free downloads.

XP worked over by their utility is pretty slick - IE has been banished
from doze here for many a year,

				Regards,
						allenpl

>
>>  I'm running OS/2 version 4.52 (inside Virtual PC running under
>>  Windows Vista)
>
>I'm impressed. I've tried a number of virtualisation programs, including 
>Virtual PC, to try to run WinXP under WinVista, without very much 
>success. The reason I've had to do it is because Vista won't run some 
>Windows programs that I need. Unfortunately some Windows applications 
>don't run well, and some don't run at all, under Vista. What happened to 
>upwards compatibility? At some stage I'll try to run those XP 
>applications under OS/2 instead, but I haven't gotten around to it.
>
>Hint to anyone buying a Windows machine: insist on getting XP installed. 
>XP is a very major improvement over Vista.
>
>-- 
>Peter Moylan                          peter at pmoylan dot org
>                                      http://www.pmoylan dot org
>

> 

>
>

----------------------------------------------------------------------------------

**= Email   13 ==========================**

Date:  Tue, 09 Dec 2008 22:24:09 +1100 (EDT)
From:  "Chris Graham [WarpSpeed]" <chrisg at warpspeed dot com dot au>
Subject:  Re:  Java programming

On Mon, 08 Dec 2008 17:45:07 +1100, David Bellair wrote:

>>Date:  Sun, 30 Nov 2008 20:52:44 +1100
>>From:  Peter Moylan <peter at pmoylan dot org>
>>Subject:   Java programming
>>
>>Has anyone ever written a Java program under OS/2? I've just tried a 
>>simple "Hello World" program and it failed. The exact sequence of 
>>commands was
>>
>>    javac HelloWorld.java
>>    java HelloWorld.class
>>
>>and the error message was
>>
>>    java.lang.NoClassDefFoundError: HelloWorld/class
>
>Hi guys
>
>The answer to Peter's error is pretty simple; he should have used the command 
>    java HelloWorld
>not
>    java HelloWorld.class
>to run his HelloWorld program.
>
>Admittedly the Java installation programs do leave the config.sys file in a bit of a mess because they don't clean out references to older versions of Java, and don't always add all the necessary stuff to the PATH.

Probably because things like LVMGUI can not run under anything but 1.1.8

>I'm running OS/2 version 4.52 (inside Virtual PC running under Windows Vista) and when I looked today it had the runtimes only (not the development kits) for Java 1.1 and Java 1.3.1 which I assume were part of the standard OS/2 install (I might be wrong).  To check things out I installed the development kit for Java 1.3.0 (which I happened to have on an IBM Software Choice CD), renamed the Java11 and java131 directories (so they were unlikely to be used), removed all references to java11 and SWING_HOME from config.sys, and added C:\java13\jre\bin; to PATH (C:\java13\bin was already there).  I could then compile and run a simple HelloWorld Java program.

-Chris

WarpSpeed Computers - The Graham Utilities for OS/2.
Voice:  +61-3-9395-1504   Internet:   chrisg at warpspeed dot com dot au
FAX:    +61-3-9395-7633   Web Page:   http://www.warpspeed dot com dot au
Postal: WarpSpeed Computers, PO Box 4293, Hoppers Crossing DC, VIC 3029, AUSTRALIA

----------------------------------------------------------------------------------

**= Email   14 ==========================**

Date:  Tue, 09 Dec 2008 22:31:49 +1100 (EDT)
From:  "Chris Graham [WarpSpeed]" <chrisg at warpspeed dot com dot au>
Subject:  Re:  Java programming

On Mon, 08 Dec 2008 22:14:09 +1100, Peter Moylan wrote:

>David Bellair wrote:
>> > From:  Peter Moylan <peter at pmoylan dot org>
>> >
>> > Has anyone ever written a Java program under OS/2? I've just tried
>> > a simple "Hello World" program and it failed. The exact sequence of
>> >  commands was
>> >
>> > javac HelloWorld.java java HelloWorld.class
>> >
>> > and the error message was
>> >
>> > java.lang.NoClassDefFoundError: HelloWorld/class
>>
>>  Hi guys
>>
>>  The answer to Peter's error is pretty simple; he should have used the
>>  command java HelloWorld not java HelloWorld.class to run his
>>  HelloWorld program.
>
>No, it was simpler than that. I just had to add "." to the CLASSPATH.
>
>I haven't gone back to check whether it makes a difference whether the 
>".class" is explicitly mentioned as an argument to Java. My original 
>problems were caused by the fact that I'd never learnt to program in 
>Java. Now that I've read further into a Java textbook, I'm disappointed 
>to discover that is yet another dialect of C, to the point where it even 
>includes some of the most shocking design faults of C. (Question: what 
>does "if (a=b=c)" mean? Answer: it's one of the design flaws that killed 

will not compile under java, as all conditionals *must* resolve to a
boolean.

SO, in the above example, you want:
if ( (a = b = c) != 0)

which is what is implied from the older C constructs.

a and b are assigned to the value of c and then tested to see if c is non
zero, if it is, then the body of the if statement is executed.

>off PL/1, a language that, unlike modern programming languages, followed 
>the bad Fortran habit of using "=" for assignment instead of comparison. 
>Second question: what does "x?y:z" mean? Answer: it's a now-obsolete 
>language feature dating from the era when the writers of C compilers 
>didn't know how to do code optimisation.) Now that I've reached this 

No, it is quite simply short hand for lazy programmers.

>point, I'm probably going to abandon Java as a viable programming language.

Why?

What are you actually attempting to do?

>Your points about clearing up the PATH, LIBPATH, etc. are well taken. 
>There is probably some scope for a new OS/2 application that tidies up 
>the CONFIG.SYS, similar to the Windows programs that do a daily check 
>for new bugs in the central registry. (Side question: the cleanup 
>programs on my Windows laptop keep reporting that the majority of 
>problems of this nature are caused by a buggy application called 
>EXPLORER.EXE. Does anyone know of a replacement for this faulty program? 
>For extra credit: how do you delete Internet Explorer from a Windows 
>installation?) There used to be a program like this, but I've forgotten 
>its name and in any case a lot of its recommendations are probably 
>obsolete by now.

iexplore(r).exe

Not sure about the trailing r.

-Chris

WarpSpeed Computers - The Graham Utilities for OS/2.
Voice:  +61-3-9395-1504   Internet:   chrisg at warpspeed dot com dot au
FAX:    +61-3-9395-7633   Web Page:   http://www.warpspeed dot com dot au
Postal: WarpSpeed Computers, PO Box 4293, Hoppers Crossing DC, VIC 3029, AUSTRALIA

----------------------------------------------------------------------------------

**= Email   15 ==========================**

Date:  Tue, 09 Dec 2008 21:36:48 +1000
From:  Mike O'Connor <mikeoc at internode.on dot net>
Subject:  Re:  Java programming

Chris Graham [WarpSpeed] wrote:
> On Mon, 08 Dec 2008 17:45:07 +1100, David Bellair wrote:
>   
>> Admittedly the Java installation programs do leave the config.sys file in a bit of a mess because they don't clean out references to older versions of Java, and don't always add all the necessary stuff to the PATH.
>>     
> Probably because things like LVMGUI can not run under anything but 1.1.8
> -Chris
>   
Hi Chris,

Not so - that problem was fixed quite a long while ago.
See attachment on your personal copy of this mail.

Regards,
Mike

[attachments have been removed]
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