From W.F.J.Mueller at gsi.de  Thu Jan  4 04:18:12 2007
From: W.F.J.Mueller at gsi.de (Walter F.J. Mueller)
Date: Wed, 03 Jan 2007 19:18:12 +0100
Subject: [pups] 2.11BSD Patch 445; FPSIM fixed;
	211bsd runs on systems without FPP
Message-ID: <459BF364.8010602@gsi.de>

A note to all 2.11bsd users:

Some time ago I looked into running 2.11bsd on systems without
floating point unit. The release notes state that this is untested
and unsupported, and indeed it didn't work.

Robin Birch some time ago fixed part of the issues, see patch 434,
but still the kernel paniced when the very first program was started.
I managed to localize and fix the problem in sys/pdp/mch_fpsim.s.

Steven Schultz right away issued 2.11BSD patch #445. All patches
up to and including 445 are provided by Steven under

   ftp://sg-1.ims.ideas.gd-ais.com/pub/2.11BSD

A patch level 445 system will now boot on simh for example on a

   set cpu 11/70 nofpp 4m

configuration and work just fine, albeit a little slower.

It should thus also work on a real 11/70 without FPP. I heard
of some 11/70 with non-working FPP's, so this maybe good news
for the owners.


			With best regards,

				Walter Mueller

-- 
Dr. Walter F.J. Müller    Mail:  W.F.J.Mueller at gsi.de
GSI,  Abteilung KP3       Phone: +49-6159-71-2766
D-64291 Darmstadt         FAX:   +49-6159-71-3762
URL: http://www-linux.gsi.de/~mueller/


From rjtucke at gmail.com  Wed Jan 24 14:11:27 2007
From: rjtucke at gmail.com (Ross Tucker)
Date: Tue, 23 Jan 2007 21:11:27 -0700
Subject: [pups] Advice on which PDP-11 processor handbook to buy
Message-ID: <2f30dc950701232011h1ac14dafgb81ab07c06b167d7@mail.gmail.com>

Hello all-
I'm a n00b on this list, so please forgive me my sins as I forgive
those who.... uh, never mind. Anyway, I am looking to get a "PDP-11
Processor Handbook" from Amazon or eBay (so I can understand the Lions
book) and there are so many different editions and versions... Lions
writes about the 11/40, but supposedly, that's not too different from
the /45 or /70. My simh boot images for v6 are for the /45 (though
supposedly I'm supposed to be able to modify them to run on the
others, right?).

What I'm asking is your advice on which Handbook to buy. Here is a
synopsis on the editions and prices from amazon:
/04/34A/44/60/70  (1979) $10
/04/34/45/55/60  (1978) $40
/70 (1975) $16
/04, 24, 34A, 70 (Jun 1981) $16
/04/05/10/35/40/45 (1975) $45

What do you think?

Thanks for your time,
Ross


From ggs at shiresoft.com  Wed Jan 24 15:17:48 2007
From: ggs at shiresoft.com (Guy Sotomayor)
Date: Tue, 23 Jan 2007 21:17:48 -0800
Subject: [pups] Advice on which PDP-11 processor handbook to buy
In-Reply-To: <2f30dc950701232011h1ac14dafgb81ab07c06b167d7@mail.gmail.com>
References: <2f30dc950701232011h1ac14dafgb81ab07c06b167d7@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <45B6EBFC.4040300@shiresoft.com>



Ross Tucker wrote:
> Hello all-
> I'm a n00b on this list, so please forgive me my sins as I forgive
> those who.... uh, never mind. Anyway, I am looking to get a "PDP-11
> Processor Handbook" from Amazon or eBay (so I can understand the Lions
> book) and there are so many different editions and versions... Lions
> writes about the 11/40, but supposedly, that's not too different from
> the /45 or /70. My simh boot images for v6 are for the /45 (though
> supposedly I'm supposed to be able to modify them to run on the
> others, right?).
>   
There are a number of differences between the /40 & /45 and /70:

    * 45 & 70 are split I & D machines
    * /40 has it own floating point that is incompatible with any others
    * 11/34 is basically an 11/40 (but can have the compatible floating
      point)
    * 70 has a Unibus map that allows it to have > 128KW (256KB).
    * 45 & 70 have user/supervisor/kernel mode while others just have
      user/kernel mode
    * there are a few other differences that escape me at the moment

> What I'm asking is your advice on which Handbook to buy. Here is a
> synopsis on the editions and prices from amazon:
> /04/34A/44/60/70  (1979) $10
> /04/34/45/55/60  (1978) $40
> /70 (1975) $16
> /04, 24, 34A, 70 (Jun 1981) $16
> /04/05/10/35/40/45 (1975) $45
>
>   
If you're trying to understand Lyons, then I'd probably go with the last 
book as the /40 & /45 were the ones most likely to be running v6 
originally (although I did run it on a /34 back in the day).

-- 

TTFN - Guy




From iking at killthewabbit.org  Wed Jan 24 15:25:52 2007
From: iking at killthewabbit.org (Ian King)
Date: Tue, 23 Jan 2007 21:25:52 -0800
Subject: [pups] Advice on which PDP-11 processor handbook to buy
In-Reply-To: <2f30dc950701232011h1ac14dafgb81ab07c06b167d7@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <032601c73f78$1d553fa0$2a0010ac@killthewabbit.org>

Wow, they're saying $40 for the 1978 book?  I don't think I'll lend out my
copy....

FYI, I run v6 on a PDP-11/34a with RK05 drives.  The kernel that boots up
from the install media tries to be pretty generic, and yes, you can make
changes to it to optimize it for various platforms.  

So the real question is: what do you want to do?  If you just want to run a
PDP-11 in emulation, any of these books will do fine for you.  The basic
PDP-11 instruction set is pretty constant across the series (with some
niggling exceptions, but nothing you're likely to deal with in an emulator).
There were extended instruction sets for some models, but again with an
emulator you can play to your heart's content.  There were some differences
in memory management, which may or may not be important depending on what
you want to run; again, v6 runs fine on an 11/34 without separate I/D
spaces, while v7 and 2.11BSD require it (as I recall).  But once again, simh
will let you rock on with any of these OS's.  

For understanding Lions (i.e. understanding the underlying hardware better),
any of these will do.  IMHO, YMMV, MOUSE.  And welcome to the community!
Cheers -- Ian 

-----Original Message-----
From: pups-bounces at minnie.tuhs.org [mailto:pups-bounces at minnie.tuhs.org] On
Behalf Of Ross Tucker
Sent: Tuesday, January 23, 2007 8:11 PM
To: pups at minnie.tuhs.org
Subject: [pups] Advice on which PDP-11 processor handbook to buy

Hello all-
I'm a n00b on this list, so please forgive me my sins as I forgive those
who.... uh, never mind. Anyway, I am looking to get a "PDP-11 Processor
Handbook" from Amazon or eBay (so I can understand the Lions
book) and there are so many different editions and versions... Lions writes
about the 11/40, but supposedly, that's not too different from the /45 or
/70. My simh boot images for v6 are for the /45 (though supposedly I'm
supposed to be able to modify them to run on the others, right?).

What I'm asking is your advice on which Handbook to buy. Here is a synopsis
on the editions and prices from amazon:
/04/34A/44/60/70  (1979) $10
/04/34/45/55/60  (1978) $40
/70 (1975) $16
/04, 24, 34A, 70 (Jun 1981) $16
/04/05/10/35/40/45 (1975) $45

What do you think?

Thanks for your time,
Ross
_______________________________________________
PUPS mailing list
PUPS at minnie.tuhs.org
https://minnie.tuhs.org/mailman/listinfo/pups



From mcquiggi at sfu.ca  Wed Jan 24 16:42:08 2007
From: mcquiggi at sfu.ca (Kevin McQuiggin)
Date: Tue, 23 Jan 2007 22:42:08 -0800
Subject: [pups] Advice on which PDP-11 processor handbook to buy
Message-ID: <200701240642.l0O6g84p009069@rm-rstar.sfu.ca>

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From mac at Wireless.Com  Wed Jan 24 17:57:41 2007
From: mac at Wireless.Com (Mike Cheponis)
Date: Tue, 23 Jan 2007 23:57:41 -0800 (PST)
Subject: [pups] Advice on which PDP-11 processor handbook to buy
In-Reply-To: <200701240642.l0O6g84p009069@rm-rstar.sfu.ca>
References: <200701240642.l0O6g84p009069@rm-rstar.sfu.ca>
Message-ID: <Pine.NEB.4.64.0701232347320.718@S.culver.net>

It's really nice to have an original paper copy, especially the 1975 one recommended.

I'd suggest eBay as a source for it, though, if you can wait a bit until one shows up.

-Mike

On Tue, 23 Jan 2007, Kevin McQuiggin wrote:

> Date: Tue, 23 Jan 2007 22:42:08 -0800
> From: Kevin McQuiggin <mcquiggi at sfu.ca>
> To: iking at killthewabbit.org
> Cc: pups at minnie.tuhs.org
> Subject: Re: [pups] Advice on which PDP-11 processor handbook to buy
> 
> Why not just download one from one of the many online archives?  Most of
> them are in PDF format.
>
> On Tue, 23 Jan 2007 21:25:52 -0800 iking at killthewabbit.org wrote:
>> Wow, they're saying $40 for the 1978 book?  I don't think I'll lend out my
>> copy....
>>
>> FYI, I run v6 on a PDP-11/34a with RK05 drives.  The kernel that boots up
>> from the install media tries to be pretty generic, and yes, you can make
>> changes to it to optimize it for various platforms.
>>
>> So the real question is: what do you want to do?  If you just want to run
> a
>> PDP-11 in emulation, any of these books will do fine for you.  The basic
>> PDP-11 instruction set is pretty constant across the series (with some
>> niggling exceptions, but nothing you're likely to deal with in an
>> emulator).
>> There were extended instruction sets for some models, but again with an
>> emulator you can play to your heart's content.  There were some
> differences
>> in memory management, which may or may not be important depending on what
>> you want to run; again, v6 runs fine on an 11/34 without separate I/D
>> spaces, while v7 and 2.11BSD require it (as I recall).  But once
>> again, simh
>> will let you rock on with any of these OS's.
>>
>> For understanding Lions (i.e. understanding the underlying hardware
>> better),
>> any of these will do.  IMHO, YMMV, MOUSE.  And welcome to the community!
>> Cheers -- Ian
>>
>> -----Original Message-----
>> From: pups-bounces at minnie.tuhs.org [mailto:pups-bounces at minnie.tuhs.org]
> On
>> Behalf Of Ross Tucker
>> Sent: Tuesday, January 23, 2007 8:11 PM
>> To: pups at minnie.tuhs.org
>> Subject: [pups] Advice on which PDP-11 processor handbook to buy
>>
>> Hello all-
>> I'm a n00b on this list, so please forgive me my sins as I forgive those
>> who.... uh, never mind. Anyway, I am looking to get a "PDP-11 Processor
>> Handbook" from Amazon or eBay (so I can understand the Lions
>> book) and there are so many different editions and versions... Lions
> writes
>> about the 11/40, but supposedly, that's not too different from the /45 or
>> /70. My simh boot images for v6 are for the /45 (though supposedly I'm
>> supposed to be able to modify them to run on the others, right?).
>>
>> What I'm asking is your advice on which Handbook to buy. Here is a
> synopsis
>> on the editions and prices from amazon:
>> /04/34A/44/60/70  (1979) $10
>> /04/34/45/55/60  (1978) $40
>> /70 (1975) $16
>> /04, 24, 34A, 70 (Jun 1981) $16
>> /04/05/10/35/40/45 (1975) $45
>>
>> What do you think?
>>
>> Thanks for your time,
>> Ross
>> _______________________________________________
>> PUPS mailing list
>> PUPS at minnie.tuhs.org
>> https://minnie.tuhs.org/mailman/listinfo/pups
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> PUPS mailing list
>> PUPS at minnie.tuhs.org
>> https://minnie.tuhs.org/mailman/listinfo/pups
>>
> _______________________________________________
> PUPS mailing list
> PUPS at minnie.tuhs.org
> https://minnie.tuhs.org/mailman/listinfo/pups
>



From bqt at softjar.se  Wed Jan 24 18:58:08 2007
From: bqt at softjar.se (Johnny Billquist)
Date: Wed, 24 Jan 2007 09:58:08 +0100
Subject: [pups] Advice on which PDP-11 processor handbook to buy
In-Reply-To: <2f30dc950701232011h1ac14dafgb81ab07c06b167d7@mail.gmail.com>
References: <2f30dc950701232011h1ac14dafgb81ab07c06b167d7@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <45B71FA0.9020403@softjar.se>

If you want to understand the PDP-11 assembly language, any of them will do.

If you want to understand the MMU and some esoteric stuff, it might be a 
good idea to get one of the books that actually cover the exact 
processor you're interested in.

The basic instruction set is the same on all of the processors. There 
are some very minor differences, but those are not even properly 
documented in most of these books, and relate to how condition codes are 
affected for some odd cases that you normally don't care about.

The major groupings you can do with the PDP-11 systems are otherwise if 
they have split I/D space, supervisor mode, unibus map and 22-bit 
addressing, floating point (none/FIS/FPP) and EIS.
Rougly, you can say:

11/34: EIS. Optional FPP.
11/40: None of that. Optional EIS and FIS.
11/44: All of it. Optional FPP.
11/45: split I/D, supervisor, EIS. Optional FPP.
11/60: EIS. Optional FPP.
11/70: All of it. Optional FPP.

	Johnny

Ross Tucker skrev:
> Hello all-
> I'm a n00b on this list, so please forgive me my sins as I forgive
> those who.... uh, never mind. Anyway, I am looking to get a "PDP-11
> Processor Handbook" from Amazon or eBay (so I can understand the Lions
> book) and there are so many different editions and versions... Lions
> writes about the 11/40, but supposedly, that's not too different from
> the /45 or /70. My simh boot images for v6 are for the /45 (though
> supposedly I'm supposed to be able to modify them to run on the
> others, right?).
> 
> What I'm asking is your advice on which Handbook to buy. Here is a
> synopsis on the editions and prices from amazon:
> /04/34A/44/60/70  (1979) $10
> /04/34/45/55/60  (1978) $40
> /70 (1975) $16
> /04, 24, 34A, 70 (Jun 1981) $16
> /04/05/10/35/40/45 (1975) $45
> 
> What do you think?
> 
> Thanks for your time,
> Ross
> _______________________________________________
> PUPS mailing list
> PUPS at minnie.tuhs.org
> https://minnie.tuhs.org/mailman/listinfo/pups


From bill at cs.uofs.edu  Wed Jan 24 21:37:19 2007
From: bill at cs.uofs.edu (Bill Gunshannon)
Date: Wed, 24 Jan 2007 06:37:19 -0500 (EST)
Subject: [pups] Advice on which PDP-11 processor handbook to buy
In-Reply-To: <45B71FA0.9020403@softjar.se>
References: <2f30dc950701232011h1ac14dafgb81ab07c06b167d7@mail.gmail.com>
	<45B71FA0.9020403@softjar.se>
Message-ID: <4961.136.218.171.21.1169638639.squirrel@www.cs.uofs.edu>


> The major groupings you can do with the PDP-11 systems are otherwise if
> they have split I/D space, supervisor mode, unibus map and 22-bit
> addressing, floating point (none/FIS/FPP) and EIS.
> Rougly, you can say:
>
> 11/34: EIS. Optional FPP.
> 11/40: None of that. Optional EIS and FIS.
> 11/44: All of it. Optional FPP.
> 11/45: split I/D, supervisor, EIS. Optional FPP.
> 11/60: EIS. Optional FPP.
> 11/70: All of it. Optional FPP

And let's not forget the CIS Option.  :-)

bill

-- 
Bill Gunshannon          |  de-moc-ra-cy (di mok' ra see) n.  Three wolves
bill at cs.scranton.edu     |  and a sheep voting on what's for dinner.
University of Scranton   |
Scranton, Pennsylvania   |         #include <std.disclaimer.h>




From bqt at softjar.se  Wed Jan 24 22:07:44 2007
From: bqt at softjar.se (Johnny Billquist)
Date: Wed, 24 Jan 2007 13:07:44 +0100
Subject: [pups] Advice on which PDP-11 processor handbook to buy
In-Reply-To: <4961.136.218.171.21.1169638639.squirrel@www.cs.uofs.edu>
References: <2f30dc950701232011h1ac14dafgb81ab07c06b167d7@mail.gmail.com>	<45B71FA0.9020403@softjar.se>
	<4961.136.218.171.21.1169638639.squirrel@www.cs.uofs.edu>
Message-ID: <45B74C10.9060506@softjar.se>

Bill Gunshannon wrote:
>>The major groupings you can do with the PDP-11 systems are otherwise if
>>they have split I/D space, supervisor mode, unibus map and 22-bit
>>addressing, floating point (none/FIS/FPP) and EIS.
>>Rougly, you can say:
>>
>>11/34: EIS. Optional FPP.
>>11/40: None of that. Optional EIS and FIS.
>>11/44: All of it. Optional FPP.
>>11/45: split I/D, supervisor, EIS. Optional FPP.
>>11/60: EIS. Optional FPP.
>>11/70: All of it. Optional FPP
> 
> And let's not forget the CIS Option.  :-)

Right. And I forgot to mention the 11/24 as well. (I'm ignoring the 
Q-bus machines, and really old/small unibus machines as well.)

So we also have CIS. And to adjust the list above:
11/24: EIS, unibus map and 22-bit addressing. Optional FPP and CIS.
11/44: Optional CIS.

	Johnny


From toby at smartgames.ca  Wed Jan 24 21:57:42 2007
From: toby at smartgames.ca (Toby Thain)
Date: Wed, 24 Jan 2007 09:57:42 -0200
Subject: [pups] Advice on which PDP-11 processor handbook to buy
In-Reply-To: <200701240642.l0O6g84p009069@rm-rstar.sfu.ca>
References: <200701240642.l0O6g84p009069@rm-rstar.sfu.ca>
Message-ID: <B83BDC30-4470-4391-9F1D-01ED44978ADF@smartgames.ca>


On 24-Jan-07, at 4:42 AM, Kevin McQuiggin wrote:

> Why not just download one from one of the many online archives?   
> Most of
> them are in PDF format.


Actually I've never seen a handbook online, and I've scoured DEC  
archives - just not for a year or so. Has this changed?

--T



From andreas.hein at berlan.de  Thu Jan 25 02:07:39 2007
From: andreas.hein at berlan.de (Andreas Hein)
Date: Wed, 24 Jan 2007 17:07:39 +0100 (CET)
Subject: [pups] Advice on which PDP-11 processor handbook to buy
In-Reply-To: <B83BDC30-4470-4391-9F1D-01ED44978ADF@smartgames.ca>
Message-ID: <10634015.41169654859125.JavaMail.root@idefix.local>

Most of the infos, i need for my own PDP11-FPGA project, i found on:

http://www.bitsavers.org/pdf/dec/pdp11

see the sub-folder "handbooks" there you will find a Processor-Handbook as well.

--AH
-------------------------
Original-Nachricht:
Von: Toby Thain <toby at smartgames.ca>
An: Kevin McQuiggin <mcquiggi at sfu.ca>
Cc: pups at minnie.tuhs.org
Datum: Mittwoch, 24 Januar 2007 13:29
Betreff: Re: [pups] Advice on which PDP-11 processor handbook to buy

On 24-Jan-07, at 4:42 AM, Kevin McQuiggin wrote:

> Why not just download one from one of the many online archives?   
> Most of
> them are in PDF format.


Actually I've never seen a handbook online, and I've scoured DEC  
archives - just not for a year or so. Has this changed?

--T

_______________________________________________
PUPS mailing list
PUPS at minnie.tuhs.org
https://minnie.tuhs.org/mailman/listinfo/pups


From W.F.J.Mueller at gsi.de  Thu Jan 25 04:52:31 2007
From: W.F.J.Mueller at gsi.de (Walter F.J. Mueller)
Date: Wed, 24 Jan 2007 19:52:31 +0100
Subject: [pups] Advice on which PDP-11 processor handbook to buy
Message-ID: <45B7AAEF.7000603@gsi.de>

Hi Ross,

you'll find on the Bitsavers Site (http://www.bitsavers.org)
lots of documents, some handbooks under

   http://www.bitsavers.org/pdf/dec/pdp11/handbooks/

and the "PDP-11 Processor Handbook - PDP11/04/34a/44/60/70" under

   http://www.bitsavers.org/pdf/dec/pdp11/handbooks/PDP11_Handbook1979.pdf

Under http://www.bitsavers.org/pdf/dec/pdp11 is quite a bit on various
pdp-11 models, for example the "KB11-C Processor Manual (PDP-11/70)"

   http://www.bitsavers.org/pdf/dec/pdp11/1170/EK-KB11C-TM-001_1170procMan.pdf

in case you'd like to go into details :).

			With best regards,	Walter

-- 
Dr. Walter F.J. Müller    Mail:  W.F.J.Mueller at gsi.de
GSI,  Abteilung KP3       Phone: +49-6159-71-2766
D-64291 Darmstadt         FAX:   +49-6159-71-3762
URL: http://www-linux.gsi.de/~mueller/


From toby at smartgames.ca  Thu Jan 25 05:13:27 2007
From: toby at smartgames.ca (Toby Thain)
Date: Wed, 24 Jan 2007 17:13:27 -0200
Subject: [pups] Advice on which PDP-11 processor handbook to buy
In-Reply-To: <45B7AAEF.7000603@gsi.de>
References: <45B7AAEF.7000603@gsi.de>
Message-ID: <06CD93CE-4338-4CFD-B643-39FF9B06C508@smartgames.ca>


On 24-Jan-07, at 4:52 PM, Walter F.J. Mueller wrote:

> Hi Ross,
>
> you'll find on the Bitsavers Site (http://www.bitsavers.org)
> lots of documents, some handbooks under
>
>    http://www.bitsavers.org/pdf/dec/pdp11/handbooks/
>
> and the "PDP-11 Processor Handbook - PDP11/04/34a/44/60/70" under
>
>    http://www.bitsavers.org/pdf/dec/pdp11/handbooks/ 
> PDP11_Handbook1979.pdf

Yes, I remember seeing that one years ago. But only that one. I guess  
the difficulty of scanning small perfect bound books (without  
guillotining the spine off) doesn't help productivity :-)

--T

>
> Under http://www.bitsavers.org/pdf/dec/pdp11 is quite a bit on various
> pdp-11 models, for example the "KB11-C Processor Manual (PDP-11/70)"
>
>    http://www.bitsavers.org/pdf/dec/pdp11/1170/EK-KB11C- 
> TM-001_1170procMan.pdf
>
> in case you'd like to go into details :).
>
> 			With best regards,	Walter
>
> -- 
> Dr. Walter F.J. Müller    Mail:  W.F.J.Mueller at gsi.de
> GSI,  Abteilung KP3       Phone: +49-6159-71-2766
> D-64291 Darmstadt         FAX:   +49-6159-71-3762
> URL: http://www-linux.gsi.de/~mueller/
> _______________________________________________
> PUPS mailing list
> PUPS at minnie.tuhs.org
> https://minnie.tuhs.org/mailman/listinfo/pups



From krhamidou at yahoo.com  Wed Jan  3 20:51:00 2007
From: krhamidou at yahoo.com (Karim Hamidou)
Date: Wed, 3 Jan 2007 02:51:00 -0800 (PST)
Subject: [TUHS] running unix v7 on a pdp emulator
Message-ID: <20070103105100.390.qmail@web35302.mail.mud.yahoo.com>

Happy new year. 

My name is karim hamidou and i'm french (you've surely
noticed that my prose isn't bright) and i'd like to
run unix v7 on the pdp emulator sim-2.3.

Do you know how to run it ?

I hope that my question isn't quite inappropriate.


Thanks for your help.

Regards. 

__________________________________________________
Do You Yahoo!?
Tired of spam?  Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around 
http://mail.yahoo.com 


From Hellwig.Geisse at mni.fh-giessen.de  Wed Jan  3 21:37:24 2007
From: Hellwig.Geisse at mni.fh-giessen.de (Hellwig Geisse)
Date: Wed, 03 Jan 2007 12:37:24 +0100
Subject: [TUHS] running unix v7 on a pdp emulator
In-Reply-To: <20070103105100.390.qmail@web35302.mail.mud.yahoo.com>
References: <20070103105100.390.qmail@web35302.mail.mud.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <1167824244.4940.100.camel@papa>

Hi Karim,

On Wed, 2007-01-03 at 02:51 -0800, Karim Hamidou wrote:
> i'd like to run unix v7 on the pdp emulator sim-2.3.

perhaps you would like to take a look into my package
(original UNIX tape files, tape file converter, simh
simulator, simulator script files, instructions how to
get things running, and a file extractor) located here:

http://homepages.fh-giessen.de/~hg53/pdp11-unix/

Good luck!
Hellwig



From 0intro at gmail.com  Wed Jan  3 21:23:49 2007
From: 0intro at gmail.com (David)
Date: Wed, 3 Jan 2007 12:23:49 +0100
Subject: [TUHS] running unix v7 on a pdp emulator
In-Reply-To: <20070103105100.390.qmail@web35302.mail.mud.yahoo.com>
References: <20070103105100.390.qmail@web35302.mail.mud.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <DAC55B9A-0356-44DC-870D-63DCB27D39DD@gmail.com>

> My name is karim hamidou and i'm french (you've surely
> noticed that my prose isn't bright) and i'd like to
> run unix v7 on the pdp emulator sim-2.3.
>
> Do you know how to run it ?
>

Hello,

Bob Supnik made a new open-source multi-platform emulator
called SIMH. The website is: http://simh.trailing-edge.com

There is "software kits" for many platforms supported
by SIMH. Unix 7 for PDP-11 is included. They are available
here: http://simh.trailing-edge.com/software.html

The accompanying documentation is available here:
http://simh.trailing-edge.com/pdf/simh_swre.pdf

It is very easy to set-up systems with these kits and this
documentation.

You will be able to run Unix 7 with SIMH soon.

I hope to have helped you.

I am french too :-)

-- 
David


From gunnarr at acm.org  Sun Jan  7 09:22:11 2007
From: gunnarr at acm.org (Gunnar Ritter)
Date: Sun, 07 Jan 2007 00:22:11 +0100
Subject: [TUHS] RAND editor e19
Message-ID: <45a02f23.DpvriVG9cjfLRrXZ%gunnarr@acm.org>

Hi,

does anyone still have the source code for the RAND editor
e19 <http://www.rand.org/pubs/notes/N2239-1/>? One can read
on the net that it was once available as public domain from
ftp.rand.org, but this machine seems not available anymore.

There is an archive rand.tar.Z in the 2.10 (BSD) directory of
CSRG CD 1, but this contains the older version e14. I think
it would be good to also have the final version e19 in the
Unix archive.

Thanks

	Gunnar


From txomsy at yahoo.es  Wed Jan 10 01:29:06 2007
From: txomsy at yahoo.es (Jose R. Valverde)
Date: Tue, 9 Jan 2007 16:29:06 +0100
Subject: [TUHS] RAND editor e19
In-Reply-To: <45a02f23.DpvriVG9cjfLRrXZ%gunnarr@acm.org>
References: <45a02f23.DpvriVG9cjfLRrXZ%gunnarr@acm.org>
Message-ID: <20070109162906.195be4ff@veda.cnb.uam.es>

Your request set me on a chase of my own. I found a dated message by Bob 
Drzyzgula praising e and giving in turn the web address of the current
maintainer.

As it turns out this page at CERN was no longer accessible, so I contacted
Bob asking if he still kept any copy. Meanwhile I tried as well to contact
the current maintainer, Fabien Perriollat and he in turn managed to get
his account at CERN unblocked.

To cut a long story short: RAND E is alive and well, being maintained by
Fabien Perriollat at CERN. The address is

	http://perrioll.home.cern.ch/perrioll/Rand_Editor/

and there you will find both the sources and executables for AIX, Linux,
Lynx OS, Solaris and Windows95.

Best regards,

				j

On Sun, 07 Jan 2007 00:22:11 +0100
Gunnar Ritter <gunnarr at acm.org> wrote:
> Hi,
> 
> does anyone still have the source code for the RAND editor
> e19 <http://www.rand.org/pubs/notes/N2239-1/>? One can read
> on the net that it was once available as public domain from
> ftp.rand.org, but this machine seems not available anymore.
> 
> There is an archive rand.tar.Z in the 2.10 (BSD) directory of
> CSRG CD 1, but this contains the older version e14. I think
> it would be good to also have the final version e19 in the
> Unix archive.
> 
> Thanks
> 
> 	Gunnar
> _______________________________________________
> TUHS mailing list
> TUHS at minnie.tuhs.org
> https://minnie.tuhs.org/mailman/listinfo/tuhs


-- 
	These opinions are mine and only mine. Hey man, I saw them first!

			    José R. Valverde

	De nada sirve la Inteligencia Artificial cuando falta la Natural

		
______________________________________________ 
LLama Gratis a cualquier PC del Mundo. 
Llamadas a fijos y móviles desde 1 céntimo por minuto. 
http://es.voice.yahoo.com


From gunnarr at acm.org  Wed Jan 10 02:17:21 2007
From: gunnarr at acm.org (Gunnar Ritter)
Date: Tue, 09 Jan 2007 17:17:21 +0100
Subject: [TUHS] RAND editor e19
In-Reply-To: <20070109162906.195be4ff@veda.cnb.uam.es>
References: <45a02f23.DpvriVG9cjfLRrXZ%gunnarr@acm.org>
	<20070109162906.195be4ff@veda.cnb.uam.es>
Message-ID: <45a3c011.qagyrj2BC0HVVdt8%gunnarr@acm.org>

"Jose R. Valverde" <txomsy at yahoo.es> wrote:

> To cut a long story short: RAND E is alive and well, being maintained by
> Fabien Perriollat at CERN.

Thanks. Here is a basic patch to make it work on CentOS 4
(and probably other Linux distributions too).

	Gunnar

diff -Naur Rand-E19.58.orig/e19/e.c Rand-E19.58/e19/e.c
--- Rand-E19.58.orig/e19/e.c	Wed Mar 20 16:21:21 2002
+++ Rand-E19.58/e19/e.c	Tue Jan  9 17:00:04 2007
@@ -27,6 +27,7 @@
 #include "e.inf.h"
 #include <sys/stat.h>
 #include <string.h>
+#include <errno.h>
 #ifdef SYSIII
 #include <fcntl.h>
 #endif /* SYSIII */
@@ -553,6 +554,11 @@
 
 /* XXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXX */
 static void keyedit ();
+static void clean_all ();
+static void exit_now ();
+static void check_message_file ();
+static int get_kbfile_dname (char *, char *, int, char **);
+static int display_bigbuf ();
 
 static void strip_path (char * path)
 {
@@ -747,8 +753,6 @@
     }
 
     if (helpflg) {
-	static void clean_all ();
-	static void exit_now ();
 	showhelp ();
 	helpflg = NO;
 	clean_all (NO); /* do not delete change and key stroke files */
@@ -2126,7 +2130,6 @@
     char *pref_name, *stname;
     Flag use_flg;
     void getConsoleSize (int *width, int *height);
-    static int display_bigbuf ();
     int i, nbli, ctrlc, nb, idx;
     char bigbuf [8192]; /* must be large enough for the message */
     char strg [256];
@@ -2332,7 +2335,6 @@
     }
 
     if ( helpflg ) {
-	static int get_kbfile_dname (char *, char *, int, char **);
 	S_looktbl *slpt;
 
 	sprintf (bigbuf + strlen (bigbuf), " Build in terminals & keyboards :");
@@ -2378,7 +2380,6 @@
     if ( check_access (xdir_dir, R_OK, &tmpstrg) )
 	sprintf (bigbuf + strlen (bigbuf), "    WARNING : %s\n", tmpstrg);
     else {
-	static void check_message_file ();
 	check_message_file (recovermsg, bigbuf);
 	/* check_message_file (xdir_kr   , bigbuf);  -- no more in use */
 	check_message_file (xdir_help , bigbuf);
diff -Naur Rand-E19.58.orig/e19/e.cm.c Rand-E19.58/e19/e.cm.c
--- Rand-E19.58.orig/e19/e.cm.c	Mon Mar  4 14:54:15 2002
+++ Rand-E19.58/e19/e.cm.c	Tue Jan  9 17:00:12 2007
@@ -17,6 +17,7 @@
 #include <dirent.h>
 #include <string.h>
 #include <sys/stat.h>
+#include <errno.h>
 #include "e.h"
 #include "e.e.h"
 #include "e.m.h"
@@ -486,11 +487,13 @@
 
 #define CLASS_CMDS_NB (sizeof (class_cmds) / sizeof (class_cmds[0]))
 
+static Cmdret call_help (char *);
+static void save_preferences ();
+static int comp_alpha_looktb (S_looktbl *obj1, S_looktbl *obj2);
 
 void init_all_lookup_tables ()
 /* does not return in case of error */
 {
-    static int comp_alpha_looktb (S_looktbl *obj1, S_looktbl *obj2);
     static Flag done = NO;
     int i, nb, cc;
     struct _lookup_table *ltbl;
@@ -931,7 +934,6 @@
 {
     extern void reset_ctrlc ();
     extern char * help_cmd_str ();
-    static Cmdret call_help (char *);
     int i, cc;
     struct _class_cmd * class_cmd_pt;
     char txt[256];
@@ -2380,7 +2382,6 @@
     extern Flag set_reset_utf8 (Flag);
     extern Flag set_reset_graph (Flag);
     extern char * get_debug_name ();
-    static void save_preferences ();
     extern int open_dbgfile (Flag append_flg);
     extern int get_debug_default_level ();
 
diff -Naur Rand-E19.58.orig/e19/e.h.c Rand-E19.58/e19/e.h.c
--- Rand-E19.58.orig/e19/e.h.c	Tue Jan 22 23:05:08 2002
+++ Rand-E19.58/e19/e.h.c	Tue Jan  9 16:54:10 2007
@@ -33,6 +33,13 @@
 /* registered resize screen routine for full screen info display */
 static void (*resize_service) () = NULL;    /* specifique resize routine */
 static void (*resize_param) (int *, int *) = NULL;  /* get current term size */
+static int browse_keyfhelp (char *, char *);
+static int print_alias_table (S_lookstruct *);
+static int browse_cmdhelp  (char *, char *);
+static int waitkb (short);
+static int help_description ();
+static Cmdret show_ambiguous ();
+extern void all_ctrl_key_by_func (char *msg, int msg_sz, int fcmd);
 
 /* browse_keyboard : display the description of the pushed key assigned function */
 /* ----------------------------------------------------------------------------- */
@@ -45,7 +52,6 @@
 {
     extern char * itsyms_by_val (short val);
     extern void ignore_quote ();
-    static int help_description ();
     char blank [128];
     char *str;
     int qq, ctrlc, sz, nbli;
@@ -414,7 +420,6 @@
 static Cmdret keyfunc_ibmpc (helparg)
 char *helparg;
 {
-    extern void all_ctrl_key_by_func (char *msg, int msg_sz, int fcmd);
     extern Flag verbose_helpflg;
     extern S_looktbl itsyms[];
     int idx, sz;
@@ -655,8 +660,6 @@
 {
     extern char *nxtop;
     extern S_looktbl cmdtable[];
-    static int browse_cmdhelp  (char *, char *);
-    static int browse_keyfhelp (char *, char *);
     extern int get_ctrlc_fkey ();
 
 static char stmsg [] = "\n\
@@ -684,7 +687,6 @@
     extern char verstr[];
     extern S_looktbl itsyms[];
     extern void set_ambiguous_param (S_looktbl *table, char *str, Flag abv);
-    static Cmdret show_ambiguous ();
     Cmdret help_ambiguous (Flag *ctrlc_flg_pt, Flag ambig_flg);
 
     if (   (helparg == NULL) || (*helparg == '\0')
@@ -1184,8 +1186,6 @@
 
 static int browse_sortedtbl (S_lookstruct *tblstruct, char * mystr, char *waitmsg)
 {
-    static int waitkb (short);
-
     char *all_aliases;
     int nb, i, di, idx, cmd_val, cc;
     char *str, *cmd_str;
@@ -1572,7 +1572,6 @@
 
 void print_sort_table (S_lookstruct *tblstruct)
 {
-    static int print_alias_table (S_lookstruct *);
     char *cmt1, *cmt2;
     int width, height;
     int i, sz;
diff -Naur Rand-E19.58.orig/e19/e.iit.c Rand-E19.58/e19/e.iit.c
--- Rand-E19.58.orig/e19/e.iit.c	Tue Jan 22 09:45:26 2002
+++ Rand-E19.58/e19/e.iit.c	Tue Jan  9 17:00:21 2007
@@ -9,6 +9,7 @@
 #endif
 
 
+#include <errno.h>
 #include <string.h>
 #include "e.h"
 #ifdef  KBFILE
@@ -205,6 +206,7 @@
 static struct itable  it_leave_ctrlc_ref;
 static int ctrlc_is_ret;
 static char ccreturn_val [2] = { CCRETURN, 0 };
+static Flag itparse ();
 
 #if 0
 int build_sorted_itsyms ()
@@ -418,7 +420,6 @@
 int level;
 {
     extern void customize_xlate ();
-    static Flag itparse ();
 
     char line[TMPSTRLEN], string[TMPSTRLEN], value[TMPSTRLEN];
     FILE *f;
diff -Naur Rand-E19.58.orig/e19/e.keyboard_map.c Rand-E19.58/e19/e.keyboard_map.c
--- Rand-E19.58.orig/e19/e.keyboard_map.c	Thu Feb 28 00:32:02 2002
+++ Rand-E19.58/e19/e.keyboard_map.c	Tue Jan  9 17:00:48 2007
@@ -38,6 +38,7 @@
 /* ---------------------------------------------------------------------- */
 
 #include <stdlib.h>
+#include <errno.h>
 
 #ifdef TEST_PROGRAM
 #define CCUNAS1 0202 /* defined in e.h */
@@ -534,6 +535,10 @@
 /*
 static short *mykb_esc_idx = nor_esc_idx;
 */
+static void print_keys (char *escp, Flag *nl_pt);
+static Flag build_escape_seq (char ch, char *escp, int idx);
+static void switch_mode (struct KTdesc *, int, Flag);
+static char * kcode2string (int, unsigned int, Flag, Flag, int *, char **, char **);
 
 #if 0
 /* for fast search */
@@ -1261,6 +1266,7 @@
 	    if ( ! keypad_appl_mode ) return (NULL);
 	    break;
 	default :
+	    ;
 	}
     strg = get_kt_strg (ktcode, NULL);
     return (strg);
@@ -1753,8 +1759,6 @@
 
 static void set_cursor_mode ()
 {
-    static void switch_mode (struct KTdesc *, int, Flag);
-
     switch ( kbmap_type ) {
 	case user_mapfile :
 	    return;
@@ -3421,8 +3425,6 @@
 static char * string2key_label (char *strg, int *key, int *idx,
 				int *shift, char **modstrg)
 {
-    static char * kcode2string (int, unsigned int, Flag, Flag, int *, char **, char **);
-
     int i, j;
     int ktf;
     char *ktstrg;
@@ -3594,9 +3596,6 @@
 
 static void checkkeyb (Flag echo)
 {
-    static void print_keys (char *escp, Flag *nl_pt);
-    static Flag build_escape_seq (char ch, char *escp, int idx);
-
     static char msg[] = "type \"Ctrl C\" exit, \"Ctrl A\" switch App mode, \"Ctrl B\" switch cusor mode\n";
     static char int_msg[] = " Interrupted control sequence\n";
     Flag app_mode, alt_cursor_mode;
diff -Naur Rand-E19.58.orig/e19/e.pa.c Rand-E19.58/e19/e.pa.c
--- Rand-E19.58.orig/e19/e.pa.c	Thu Feb 21 23:09:09 2002
+++ Rand-E19.58/e19/e.pa.c	Tue Jan  9 16:56:23 2007
@@ -56,6 +56,7 @@
 
 static S_lookstruct tblstr [lookuptbl_comment_sz];
 
+static int longest_cmd (char *, S_looktbl *, int);
 
 #ifdef COMMENT
 Small
@@ -422,7 +423,6 @@
 
     if ( max_flg ) {
 	/* found the longest keyword string */
-	static int longest_cmd (char *, S_looktbl *, int);
 	idx1 = longest_cmd (kwd, table, table[idx].val);
 	if ( idx1 >= 0 ) idx = idx1;
     }
diff -Naur Rand-E19.58.orig/e19/e.u.c Rand-E19.58/e19/e.u.c
--- Rand-E19.58.orig/e19/e.u.c	Sun Feb 17 23:05:16 2002
+++ Rand-E19.58/e19/e.u.c	Tue Jan  9 16:51:03 2007
@@ -23,6 +23,7 @@
 extern Cmdret remove_file (Fn fn);
 
 static Fn getnxfn ();
+static char *ReadSymLink (char *);
 
 /* variables used to list the edited file */
 static int term_width, term_height; /* current display size */
@@ -473,7 +474,6 @@
      */
     Block {
 	char *cp;
-	static char *ReadSymLink (char *);
 
 	cp = ReadSymLink (file);
 	if (cp == NULL) {
diff -Naur Rand-E19.58.orig/e19/term/linux_pc.c Rand-E19.58/e19/term/linux_pc.c
--- Rand-E19.58.orig/e19/term/linux_pc.c	Thu Feb 28 00:32:02 2002
+++ Rand-E19.58/e19/term/linux_pc.c	Tue Jan  9 17:00:48 2007
@@ -38,6 +38,7 @@
 /* ---------------------------------------------------------------------- */
 
 #include <stdlib.h>
+#include <errno.h>
 
 #ifdef TEST_PROGRAM
 #define CCUNAS1 0202 /* defined in e.h */
@@ -534,6 +535,10 @@
 /*
 static short *mykb_esc_idx = nor_esc_idx;
 */
+static void print_keys (char *escp, Flag *nl_pt);
+static Flag build_escape_seq (char ch, char *escp, int idx);
+static void switch_mode (struct KTdesc *, int, Flag);
+static char * kcode2string (int, unsigned int, Flag, Flag, int *, char **, char **);
 
 #if 0
 /* for fast search */
@@ -1261,6 +1266,7 @@
 	    if ( ! keypad_appl_mode ) return (NULL);
 	    break;
 	default :
+	    ;
 	}
     strg = get_kt_strg (ktcode, NULL);
     return (strg);
@@ -1753,8 +1759,6 @@
 
 static void set_cursor_mode ()
 {
-    static void switch_mode (struct KTdesc *, int, Flag);
-
     switch ( kbmap_type ) {
 	case user_mapfile :
 	    return;
@@ -3421,8 +3425,6 @@
 static char * string2key_label (char *strg, int *key, int *idx,
 				int *shift, char **modstrg)
 {
-    static char * kcode2string (int, unsigned int, Flag, Flag, int *, char **, char **);
-
     int i, j;
     int ktf;
     char *ktstrg;
@@ -3594,9 +3596,6 @@
 
 static void checkkeyb (Flag echo)
 {
-    static void print_keys (char *escp, Flag *nl_pt);
-    static Flag build_escape_seq (char ch, char *escp, int idx);
-
     static char msg[] = "type \"Ctrl C\" exit, \"Ctrl A\" switch App mode, \"Ctrl B\" switch cusor mode\n";
     static char int_msg[] = " Interrupted control sequence\n";
     Flag app_mode, alt_cursor_mode;


