From jeverett@wwa.com.defeat.uce.bots Tue Dec 17 12:11:39 1996 Path: stc06.ctd.ornl.gov!news.he.net!news.enteract.com!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!enews.sgi.com!news.mathworks.com!newsfeed.internetmci.com!news.wwa.com!news From: jeverett@wwa.com.defeat.uce.bots (John Everett) Newsgroups: comp.std.misc,comp.terminals,alt.folklore.computers Subject: Re: Early history of ASCII? Date: 16 Dec 1996 17:17:11 GMT Organization: WorldWide Access (tm) - Chicagoland Internet Services (http://www.wwa.com) Lines: 31 Message-ID: <59406n$663@kirin.wwa.com> References: <58hfvg$l57@nntp.ucs.ubc.ca> <591p1s$kiu@access2.digex.net> NNTP-Posting-Host: pool14-022.wwa.com Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: Text/Plain; charset=US-ASCII X-Newsreader: WinVN 0.99.8 (x86 32bit) Xref: stc06.ctd.ornl.gov comp.std.misc:1574 comp.terminals:8427 alt.folklore.computers:150012 In article <591p1s$kiu@access2.digex.net>, kfl@access2.digex.net says... > >Robert S. Maier wrote: >> I distinctly remember seeing, back in the early 1980's, an old >> character-cell terminal that represented the ^ character (caret, >> octal \136) by an up-arrow, and the _ character (underscore, \137) >> by a right-arrow. The terminal must have dated back to the early >> 1970's. > >Are you sure the underscore wasn't a LEFT-arrow? > Back in the mid '60s, most of DEC's software depended on the presence of a left-arrow. The PDP-6 PIP syntax used a command string like: RESULT.FIL<-FILE.FOO,FILE.BAR to combine two files, only the "<-" was a single character left-arrow; or as we called it then, a backarrow. When presented with a TTY with an alternate keyboard we substituted the underscore key. It was only when terminals without backarrows became common that we changed the CUSPs (anyone still remember that term) to accept the equals sign in place of the backarrow. At least with an arrow it was clear which argument was source and which destination. TOPS-10 had a COPY command which invoked PIP. When I first started to use DOS, I had a terrible time getting COPY to do what I meant. -- jeverett@wwa.com (John V. Everett) http://www.wwa.com/~jeverett From bqt@Zeke.Update.UU.SE Tue Dec 17 12:11:51 1996 Path: stc06.ctd.ornl.gov!news.he.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!howland.erols.net!news-peer.gsl.net!news.gsl.net!news-stkh.gsl.net!news.gsl.net!eru.mt.luth.se!newsfeed.luth.se!news.luth.se!erix.ericsson.se!eua.ericsson.se!erinews.ericsson.se!news.seinf.abb.se!news.mdh.se!columba.udac.uu.se!Zeke.Update.UU.SE!Zeke.Update.UU.SE!not-for-mail From: bqt@Zeke.Update.UU.SE (Johnny Billquist) Newsgroups: comp.std.misc,comp.terminals,alt.folklore.computers Subject: Re: Early history of ASCII? Date: 17 Dec 1996 11:39:59 +0100 Organization: Update Computer Club Lines: 32 Message-ID: <595t9v$1ci$1@Zeke.Update.UU.SE> References: <58hfvg$l57@nntp.ucs.ubc.ca> <591p1s$kiu@access2.digex.net> <59406n$663@kirin.wwa.com> NNTP-Posting-Host: zeke.update.uu.se X-Newsreader: NN version 6.5.1 (NOV) Xref: stc06.ctd.ornl.gov comp.std.misc:1575 comp.terminals:8432 alt.folklore.computers:150039 In <59406n$663@kirin.wwa.com> jeverett@wwa.com.defeat.uce.bots (John Everett) writes: > >Back in the mid '60s, most of DEC's software depended on the presence of a >left-arrow. The PDP-6 PIP syntax used a command string like: > >RESULT.FIL<-FILE.FOO,FILE.BAR > >to combine two files, only the "<-" was a single character left-arrow; or as >we called it then, a backarrow. When presented with a TTY with an alternate >keyboard we substituted the underscore key. It was only when terminals >without backarrows became common that we changed the CUSPs (anyone still >remember that term) to accept the equals sign in place of the backarrow. At >least with an arrow it was clear which argument was source and which >destination. CUSPs... Sure. Still use 'em. :-) Anyway, you skipped a step. The change wasn't immediately from the backarrow to the equal sign. In between, dec used the '<' instead of the backarrow in CUSPs. It's still the character you use in OS/8, if you don't feel like using the underscore (unless you have a real TTY). Now, how many knows what a TTY *really* is? :-) Johnny -- Johnny Billquist || "I'm on a bus || on a psychedelic trip email: bqt@update.uu.se || Reading murder books pdp is alive! || tryin' to stay hip" - B. Idol